Familial aka Genetic Hyperlipidemia IE High Cholesterol; What have you find helpful

[Posterboy]

To All,

Here is the thread I said I was going to start for Wheatwacked and Knitty Kitty.

First part of this discussion can be found in this thread...

Wheatwacked......Knitty Kitty has give you good advice as usual.

I was only trying to be quick and left off my medical use of Niacin.....I had taken Niacin (as a doctor proscribed) treatment for High Cholesterol......but it didn't keep it low....only when I was taking Niacin did it help my high cholesterol.

I will be short/brief tonight because I have already commented on a thread already and need to do some other things tonight.

But here is the best article I have read on Niacin....

https://www.hindawi.com/journals/mi/2014/263786/

Niacin is a natural vasodilators and increases blood flow into your capillaries causing the flushing people feel when taking Niacin in high doses....

Here is a nice overview on why "inviting" the Niacin flush is healthy for you...

https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/niacin-flush#Why-people-take-large-doses-of-niacin

I hope this is helpful but it is not medical advice.

Posterboy,

[Posterboy]

Wheatwacked and Knitty Kitty et Al,

Here is some great links I came across that might that might help you Wheatwacked.

Dietary foods don't usually change your Cholesterol (though some do like eggs for example because they are good sources of Choline etc and help cholesterol for the better I might add.).....and are not as bad for Cholesterol as is commonly (putatively) believed.

https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/panel-suggests-stop-warning-about-cholesterol-in-food-201502127713

Wheatwacked don't over stress on your low HDL (I think you mentioned) this correct me If I am wrong...

https://www.webmd.com/cholesterol-management/news/20100722/cholesterol-study-may-not-be-so-bad

See this very recent article that shows Cholesterol issues in Type I and Type II diabetes can be from low Thiamine levels.....which explains why they often develop NAFLD IE Fatty liver first...

https://www.cureus.com/articles/31208-thiamine-level-in-type-i-and-type-ii-diabetes-mellitus-patients-a-comparative-study-focusing-on-hematological-and-biochemical-evaluations

quoting their conclusions...

Conclusion

"The study results revealed that FBS, RBS, HbA1c, triglyceride, and total cholesterol levels were significantly higher in both type I and type II diabetes patients compared to controls. Furthermore, HDL and serum thiamine levels were found to be significantly lower in both type I and type II diabetic patients than in controls."

This hormones matter article explains why/how we go in this mindset "Cholesterol" is bad for the heart mentality...which we need (Cholesterol) to make our hormones from.....

https://www.hormonesmatter.com/misguided-battle-dietary-fat-cholesterol/

Fat doesn't elevate Cholesterol or going Low CARB and KETO wouldn't help Cholesterol levels...

IT is too many CARBS as the hormones matter site explains well.....a sign we have become low in Cholesterol.....and maybe Cooper too!

See also this great article explaining how Copper can often play a role in "genetically high" cholesterol....

Is/has been in my experience just a Vitamin/Mineral deficiency....

Research on Copper entitled "The Role of Copper as a Modifier of Lipid Metabolism"

https://www.intechopen.com/books/lipid-metabolism/the-role-of-copper-as-a-modifier-of-lipid-metabolism

Panothenic Acid aka B5 or Panthenic Complex can also help Cholesterol....for the reason mentioned in the Hormones Matter article.....it (B5) is import for Coenzyme A....a precursor to Cholesterol (If I read the article correctly)

I hope this is helpful but it is not medical advice.

Posterboy,

[Wheatwacked]

thanks for starting this topic.

Back in the sixties, people in the hospital on intravenous feedings were getting non-alcoholic fatty liver disease. Eventually it was discovered to be caused by lack of choline. Now they add separate choline to the intravenous feeding. The choline clears the fat.

33 minutes ago, Posterboy said:

which explains why they often develop NAFLD IE Fatty liver first...

 

35 minutes ago, Posterboy said:

Fat doesn't elevate Cholesterol or going Low CARB and KETO wouldn't help Cholesterol levels...

Low fat is a big scam. Same about egg yolk because of cholesterol although I wonder if leaky gut changes that. Eggs are a major source of choline (NAFLD). My daily intake was 50% RDA so I usually take 500mg supplement. Haven't read your links yet, but will . Copper is one of the minerals I track and am consistently above minimum. My brother, on Atkins diet was taken off cholesterol meds, but I don't believe carbs is the answer. Obviously I can't blame it on wheat so it has to be something else that you eat more of on a low carb diet.

Once I started GFD, my contacts stopped getting protein buildup (can we say library paste?) so I don't have to clean them and usually go six months without taking them out. I hope it is having the same effect on arterial plaque. That is my concern with cholesterol. Also the liver converts cholesterol to DHEA, which has an inverse relationship with age. Why?

[Scott Adams]

I'm in the group of naturally high cholesterol (stays close of 300) that I tried for years to treat naturally, but in the end couldn't. I'm on a low dose statin that seems to work very well for me, and I've not noticed any negative side effects from it. I've got heart disease on both sides of my family, and my father passed away of a heart attack at 48, so I'm inclined to defer to the medical field on this topic.

I do believe that some people may be able to avoid drugs like statins and get their cholesterol under control with dietary changes and supplements, however this approach won't work for everyone.

[Wheatwacked]

31 minutes ago, Scott Adams said:

I've got heart disease on both sides of my family, and my father passed away of a heart attack at 48

Sorry for your loss. Similar family. My maternal grandfather passed at 39.

[Wheatwacked]

Saturated fatty acids in general, and palmitic acid (C16:0) in particular, are harmful in part because they elevate LDL cholesterol and atherosclerosis risk7. Dietary stearic acid (C18:0), however, does not increase atherosclerosis risk, and, if anything, actually reduces LDL cholesterol7,8,9,10. Indeed, increased levels of circulating C18:0 lipids are associated with reduced blood pressure, improved heart function, and reduced cancer risk11,12,13,14,15. Hence unlike other saturated fatty acids, and contrary to the general belief that saturated fatty acids are harmful, C18:0 appears to have some beneficial effects on human health. The molecular mechanisms of this, however, are not clear. https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-018-05614-6

"Compared with stearic acid, palmitic acid increased the yield of milk fat and improved feed efficiency across production level of cows...compared with SA, PA increased the secretion of C16:0 (113 g/d) and its desaturation product, cis-9 C16:1 (4.5 g/d), into milk, whereas SA only modestly increased C18:0 secretion into milk (13 g/d) and did not have an effect on its desaturation product, cis-9 C18:1. These results would suggest that efficiency of incorporation of C16:0 into milk fat is greater than that of C18:0

Dietary supplementation with C16:0 improved milk fat concentration and yield as well as the efficiency of feed conversion into milk compared with C18:0 supplementation. " https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0022030213008436

"the fatty acid stearic acid (C18:0) signals via a dedicated pathway to regulate mitofusin activity and thereby mitochondrial morphology and function...glucose elicits a strong insulin secretion response, systemically activating insulin and PI3K signaling, thereby restoring blood sugar levels to “normal”, whereas fructose only elicits a weak response"

So similar to the modern wheat story in the cases of dairy and high fructose corn syrup it seems to come down to profit margin vs. health.💲

 

 

 

[Posterboy]

On 2/22/2021 at 12:46 PM, Scott Adams said:

I'm in the group of naturally high cholesterol (stays close of 300) that I tried for years to treat naturally, but in the end couldn't. I'm on a low dose statin that seems to work very well for me, and I've not noticed any negative side effects from it. I've got heart disease on both sides of my family, and my father passed away of a heart attack at 48, so I'm inclined to defer to the medical field on this topic.

I do believe that some people may be able to avoid drugs like statins and get their cholesterol under control with dietary changes and supplements, however this approach won't work for everyone.

Scott,

Mine use to be too high too????

Have you ever tried taking some Vitamin K.

Once I took some of it (Vitamin K).....it tracks low (often when we are Low in Vitamin D) since they are both Fat Soluble Vitamins.

My Cholesterol has been within normal range.....most of the time

Here is a couple articles about it....

Nice summary article...

https://www.secondopinionnewsletter.com/Health-Alert-Archive/View-Archive/13813/Effects-of-Vitamin-K2-on-Cholesterol-Levels-and-Plaque-Formation-.htm

Here is the raw research on it..

Entitled "Effects of vitamin K2 (menatetrenone) on atherosclerosis and blood coagulation in hypercholesterolemic rabbits"

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/9414028/

Todays' Dietitian has a nice overview on Vitamin K2

"Vitamin K2 — A Little-Known Nutrient Can Make a Big Difference in Heart and Bone Health"

https://www.todaysdietitian.com/newarchives/060113p54.shtml

Vitamin K has also been studied as helpful aid in Rheumatoid Arthritis.

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/5366740_Vitamin_K_and_rheumatoid_arthritis

Not surprising it is 10 or 12 years old and you never hear about how Vitamin K can help RA.

And this is for others who might come across it that that also might be taken statins for their cholesterol.

Be sure to take it (statin) with CoQ10 if you develop muscle pain (Myopathy) while taking it.

I developed muscle pain and memory loss while taking a statin.....so I know my body doesn't tolerate being low in CoQ10 well...

See this research about it entitled "Coenzyme Q10 and statin-related myopathy"

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/25977402/

Maybe this will help the next person who comes across this thread.  Vitamin K helped my "Genetically High" Cholesterol.....telling me I was low in Vitamin K and the doctor's didn't know to test for it!

I hope this is helpful but it is not medical advice.

Posterboy,

[Scott Adams]

Thanks for the input, and the references. I haven't tried vitamin K specifically, but your "most of the time" experience would not work for me, as I want my bad cholesterol lower all of the time, and my good cholesterol higher all of the time, which is what's been occurring after a low dose generic Lipitor for several years now. My family history is just too big of a factor for me be wrong here, or to lead others down the wrong path. 

There is also a lot of misinformation out there about the long term effects of statins, and in my experience they've all been positive so far. 

One big issue with attempting to manage cholesterol on your own is that there is no simple way for you to monitor your levels on a daily basis, like diabetics can do with their blood sugar levels. Until a similar inexpensive test is developed, I doubt that anyone in my category of genetically high cholesterol can really claim that they've got it fully under control with diet and supplements. I'm sure these people experience ups and downs which may negatively impact their health, and put them at higher risk for heart disease.

Science has shown that people who respond well to statins can be randomly tested at any time, and most will have their cholesterol levels fully under control for as long as they are taking their pill each day, which has been my experience.

I would not go down the rabbit hole of believing that supplements can solve all health issues, even though I do believe that supplements are a huge and often ignored factor in the many ailments that come with having celiac disease.

[Posterboy]

On 2/24/2021 at 12:35 PM, Scott Adams said:

Thanks for the input, and the references. I haven't tried vitamin K specifically, but your "most of the time" experience would not work for me, as I want my bad cholesterol lower all of the time, and my good cholesterol higher all of the time, which is what's been occurring after a low dose generic Lipitor for several years now. My family history is just too big of a factor for me be wrong here, or to lead others down the wrong path. 

Scott,

I totally understand.....

I was just trying to point out things that helped me....

And also I once was you....I had chronically  high Cholesterol levels....

That wouldn't go down for anything.....until I found the missing ingredient....(IE proper Vitamin)

From the other thread (I don't know if you had a chance to read it or not)....

I also mentioned Thiamine.....I had took Vitamin K and Benfotiamine together and since that time my "Familial IE Genetic High Cholesterol"  has been normal.....

I would refer you back to this very interesting article on why we worry about Cholesterol in our diet's today instead of TOO many CARBS instead....which can trigger us to have high cholesterol in the first place...

https://www.hormonesmatter.com/misguided-battle-dietary-fat-cholesterol/

All those CARBS deplete our Thiamine....

Here is the great "Smoking Gun" research that shows how Benfotiamine lowers Cholesterol in Diabetics' and "Normal Healthy" patients...

Entitled "Metabolic Benefits of Six-month Thiamine Supplementation in Patients With and Without Diabetes Mellitus Type 2"

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24550684/

quoting

"In all groups, there was a significant decrease in total cholesterol after three months (p = 0.03) as well as in HDL cholesterol after six months of thiamine supplementation (p = 0.009). Significant improvements were also observed in the mean serum levels of creatinine (p = 0.001), as well as thiamine and its derivatives in both serum and urinary levels across follow-up visits"

I took it (Thiamine) originally for my high creatinine levels....not Cholesterol and it (Benfotamine) helped both!

This is not an either/or proposition....

Take both of them.....get better anyway you can.....

Continue using your statins if you tolerate them well.....

And I know you are taking Benfotiamine now from another thread....and since you started both Magnesium Citrate and Benfotiamine your Neuropathy has gotten better!

This/that is no accident.....you just found the missing ingredient...

https://www.naturalmedicinejournal.com/journal/2018-11/thiamine-deficiency-and-diabetic-polyneuropathy

The take way is you don't to be diabetic for Benfotamine to help you with your genetically high cholesterol....it helps even healthy non diabetics....

Sometimes we don't know what we should take.....but when we do....it makes sense to take them...

(That is where good quality research come into play....it directs us in finding out what can help....)

Vitamin K2 and B1 as Benfotiamine both helped my chronically high "Familial aka Genetically High Cholesterol" come down to normal levels.....

I hope this is helpful but it is not medical advice.

Posterboy,

[Wheatwacked]

On 2/24/2021 at 1:35 PM, Scott Adams said:

low dose generic Lipitor

If the statins had worked for me I would have continued. Unfortunately Lipitor doubled my urine and I had persistent cough both interfering with sleep in their own ways, and eventually led to an inguinal hernia. Amlodipine dehydrated my eyes so I could not wear contacts. They did not lower my cholesterol. Many drugs do not work on me the way it does for others. I go to sleep better with coffee or espresso at bedtime, Ritalin makes me focused not jittery, Zanax makes me twitch all over and it feels like there are toothpicks holding my eyes open. My brother, on the other hand is fine on his statins; as did my father and mother.  I am getting tested every three months by my primary care. In the meantime my glucose and A1c are now normal and systolic blood pressure ranges from 130 down to 100 instead of last years' 130 up to 180. It'll take time but I'll find it( or die trying😁?!)

11 hours ago, Posterboy said:

Thiamine Supplementation in Patients...significant decrease in total cholesterol... as well as in HDL cholesterol

"Pantethine, a byproduct of vitamin B5 (pantothenic acid), may help reduce the amount of cholesterol made by the body. Several preliminary and several controlled trials have found that pantethine (300 mg taken two to four times per day) significantly lowers serum cholesterol levels and may also increase HDL."https://wa.kaiserpermanente.org/kbase/topic.jhtml?docId=hn-2927004. 

I can't help but remembering that the Icelandic Eskimos had no metabolic diseases until the 1950's when they were encouraged to adopt a western diet.

[Wheatwacked]

46 minutes ago, Wheatwacked said:

They did not lower my cholesterol.

correction, should read Blood pressure.

[Posterboy]

Wheatwacked,

This would be around the time that you started Magnesium....

I tried your Potassium it did not help my Blood sugar.....

Magnesium will naturally lower BP 10% on average.....Niacin(amide) will do the same....

But the biggest change to BP was when I took Riboflavin aka Vitamin B2. It also helped my elevated Homocysteine levels... I went from taking 3 BPMs at the time down to one....and my homocysteine levels also got better.

I had taken a "FABB" tablet before then....and haven't had to take it since I took Riboflavin.....

Here is a couple good links/research about Riboflavin.

Entitled "Riboflavin intake and 5-year blood pressure change in Chinese adults: interaction with hypertensive medication"

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24791577/

And this Jeffery Dach MD article on Riboflavin and Hypertension article on high blood pressure and how Riboflavin can help it and any homoycsteine problems you might have.

https://jeffreydachmd.com/2015/11/riboflavin-hypertension-mthfr/

I hope this is helpful but it is not medical advice.

Good luck on your continued journey!

Posterboy,

[Posterboy]

On 2/27/2021 at 9:44 PM, Wheatwacked said:

"Pantethine, a byproduct of vitamin B5 (pantothenic acid), may help reduce the amount of cholesterol made by the body. Several preliminary and several controlled trials have found that pantethine (300 mg taken two to four times per day) significantly lowers serum cholesterol levels and may also increase HDL."https://wa.kaiserpermanente.org/kbase/topic.jhtml?docId=hn-2927004. 

Wheatwacked,

I concur with your B-5 Pantothenic Acid research.....

I had taken it too.....they recommend it as Pantothenic Complex.....for some reason taking "Straight B-5" doesn't do it....

I think I mentioned (B-5) in the other thread......I took B-5 for a while (I've taken all the B-Vitamins) at one time or another to see which ones might help my blood sugar issues....

Here is some neat recent research on B-5.

Entitled "Cerebral deficiency of vitamin B5 (d-pantothenic acid; pantothenate) as a potentially-reversible cause of neurodegeneration and dementia in sporadic Alzheimer's disease"

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32416962/#:~:text=Vitamin%20B5%20is%20the%20obligate%20precursor%20of%20CoA%2Facetyl-CoA,the%20metabolism%20of%20all%20organs%2C%20including%20the%20brain.

We need B-5 like B-1 to make Acetylcholine.....

I mentioned B-5 because it is important for Coenzyme A which can help with cholesterol too!

This hormones matter article about it explains the connection...

https://www.hormonesmatter.com/misguided-battle-dietary-fat-cholesterol/

quoting

"Cholesterol Is Made from Acetyl CoA and Acetoacetyl CoA, Not Fat

Cholesterol is made from two molecules in a total of about 39 hard steps by our liver (or we can eat it like egg yolks). Would our body go through such hard work of creating something (Cholesterol) if it ended up causing our death? It is not even plausible that human evolution would have supported such counter mechanism."

Taking Choline or Lecthin can also help Cholesterol (and will sharpen the mind as well) because we can then make the neurotransmitter acecylcholine from them....

I recommend Lecithin.....if you haven't tried it.....it is good for mental focus and clarity...

Choline is marketed as  "Brain Food" because it is used by the body to make Acetylcholine...

Eating eggs is a good source of Choline and it is recommended up to 2 eggs a day can help Cholesterol for that reason....

I hope this is helpful but it is not medical advice.

Posterboy,

 

[CMCM]

I've been reading the above comments with interest.  I've pretty much always had high cholesterol readings and it's clearly familial.  My HDL has almost always been nicely high (70's and 80's) until my last test, which showed up as the lowest I've ever had, something like 47 I think it was.  My LDLs have always been bad to terrible, although my doctor started ordering (at my request!!) tests to determine whether the LDL particles were small and dense or fluffy and larger.  I always came up with the more desirable fluffy type....until last time!  Triglycerides always fluctuate, although my doctor said those were more transitory.  At one point in time she recommended taking statins, then since I was reluctant to take them, she said red yeast rice was a good alternative although it functions similarly to statins.  I also declined that.  Eventually, with the tests showing the desirable LDL pattern type and a total lack of heart disease in my family, she doesn't say much any more and says she doesn't worry about my cholesterol numbers so much.  I'll add that I've always been a normal weight, somewhat on the slim side, and no diabetes etc.  

All this said, I still worry a bit, and I'm puzzled why this last test (done in September) was out of my norm with a suddenly lower HDL and much higher LDL and pattern type change.  I wonder if this had anything at all to do with my coming gluten crisis point which occurred on December 28.   Perhaps.

As for blood pressure, doctors have said my BP is high since I was 20.  I've noticed over the years that the acceptable blood pressure numbers keep creeping downwards.  At one point maybe 10 years ago, I had period of very high spikes  (up to 180 or some such) and that frightened me so I agreed to take a fairly modest dosage of a BP medication called triamterere HCTZ, which is partially a diuretic. It seems to work well enough for me.

I just ordered some Benfotiamine (thinking it might help with my foot neuropathy per some comments made by Scott on another thread).  Now I'm wondering if the addition of K would be good too to perhaps help on the high cholesterol end.  At this point I think certain vitamin supplements might help due to the gluten connection, but I'm not sure which yet.  

 

[Scott Adams]

Let us know how it works out, and I would not completely exclude statins. It makes sense to first try a non-statin approach that might include diet changes, exercise, and supplements. Although I didn't include K at that time, I was including the other vitamins and mineral supplements mentioned here. I did also try red yeast rice for around six months, and I did improve my readings by around 20%, but I needed more like a 50% change.

[Posterboy]

On 3/2/2021 at 1:40 PM, CMCM said:

My HDL has almost always been nicely high (70's and 80's) until my last test, which showed up as the lowest I've ever had, something like 47 I think it was.

CMCM

Extremely elevated HDL levels can be a sign of inflammation instead of a Good sign.....especially if you also have had an elevated C-Reactive Protein test....aka CRP.

Here is an article about it....

https://www.healthline.com/health/high-hdl#issues

A matter of fact those with HDL levels over 100 is an independent risk factor for heart problems....and they don't know why....

It is because HDL in high numbers can turn from protective to predictor of inflammation......and this is not well understood.

Now remember Benfotiamine lowers this inflammation caused by excessively high HDL levels...

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24550684

This Awaken article explains how taking Benfotiamine naturally lowers stress/inflammation in the body...

https://awaken.com/2021/02/the-overlooked-vitamin-that-improves-autoimmune-disease-and-autonomic-dysfunction/

quoting form the awaken article...

"Impressively, benfotiamine also reduces activation of the nuclear factor kappa beta (NFkB) signaling pathway, the gateway to inflammatory eicosanoid mediators, and mitigates signaling down the arachidonic acid pathway, inhibiting the same cyclooxygenase (COX) enzymes (3) exploited by non-steroidal anti-inflammatory drugs (NSAIDs) without the deleterious side effects"

So.....the lower HDL from eating gluten free could be a sign your inflammation in the body has dropped.....indicating eating gluten free is now helping you!

See also this thread that explains how C-Reactive Protein aka CrP test can be helpful for tracking inflammation in the body....

https://www.celiac.com/forums/topic/154505-painful-cysts-in-breasts-disappeared/

What most people don't know that about HDL is (at least at too high a level) it can be a marker of high inflammation and explains perfectly why taking Benfotiamine a Fat Soluble B-1 can help elevate HDL levels that are elevated high enough to trigger inflammation in the body....

Taking Niacin helps in a similar way....

https://www.hindawi.com/journals/mi/2014/263786/

I once had both....an elevated CrP and "Genetically" high Cholesterol triggered by Low Thiamine Levels in my blood....a sign of unchecked inflammation!

I hope this is helpful but it is not medical advise.

Posterboy,

[CMCM]

Interesting info Posterboy.  However, that cholesterol test with the suddenly lower HDL was done back in September, BEFORE I went gluten free again.  There was another oddity in my tests....I'm thinking it was a higher red blood cell count which my doctor remarked on, but she hasn't really followed up on it.  I'm going to request another bunch of tests in a few months, but I don't want to wait until my yearly exam in September.

Thanks for the article link.  Only thing that stood out was that I generally take Omega 3 supplements, and sounds like that could boost HDL scores.

I need to look into this more, but most important for now, I want to see the effect of a gluten & dairy free diet after a few months of it.

[Wheatwacked]

On 2/24/2021 at 1:35 PM, Scott Adams said:

I would not go down the rabbit hole of believing that supplements can solve all health issues, even though I do believe that supplements are a huge and often ignored factor in the many ailments that come with having celiac disease.

Supplements are useful in cases of malabsorption syndromes (like Celiac Disease, IBS) and dietary intake deficiencies (anorexia, iodine, folate). Some, like Pantothenic Acid and Thiamine, in massive doses override the normal absorption route and can have effects similar to prescribed medicines.  Going on a gluten-free diet will resolve the malabsorption as the villi recover, but the diet deficiencies, though not a Celiac problem, still need to be addressed, That is what I have learned the past year by quantitatively tracking my diet.

On 2/28/2021 at 5:55 PM, Posterboy said:

I tried your Potassium it did not help my Blood sugar

I assume you meant blood pressure. By eating more potassium containing foods (RDA is 4700 mg/day) it also changed my Potassium to Sodium intake ratio (the point of the DASH diet). Here's my numbers. 2020 I made sure to get 5 grams a day, January 2021 I started complying with Nutritarian guidelines and indeed started to see my glucose improve. Feb 12, I stopped Prednisone at the urging of my doctor. Notice the biggest change was the potassium. Prednisone had an effect but it made my life bearable for eight years and does not have a side effect of instant death that the doctors preferred choices do. Virtually all the potassium one eats is excreted through the kidneys, colon and sweat. The 24 hour urine test is apparently the best lab test for daily intake, but it's easy enough to monitor what you eat every day because it is now required on all food labels. The potassium/sodium blood ratio is so crucial to life, raising the cellular level takes a long time. For me it was nine months. If you do not eat enough potassium, your cells and bones sacrifice their content to maintain the blood balance. I have no research proof but I suspect this is why our skin wrinkles with age. Our cells need the proper potassium/sodium gradient to facilitate cellular nutrition. My next lab tests are in a month and I may consider pantothenic acid, thiamine or statins if no improvements in my lipids. I was once prescribed Niacin, but it was ineffectual.

 

[Posterboy]

7 hours ago, Wheatwacked said:

I tried your Potassium it did not help my Blood sugar

7 hours ago, Wheatwacked said:

I assume you meant blood pressure.

Wheatwacked,

NO, I mean my Blood Sugar....

I regularly test my blood sugar....it went up and stayed up for at least a week.....before now coming down again.....

The only supplement I took was the Potassium......so I know it was the Potassium.

Magnesium, in part, is how we normally  balance our Potassium levels....

I haven't had Potassium problems since I have been taking Magnesium Citrate/Glycinate....

Low Potassium levels can also be a "Symptom" of Refeeding Syndrome....in Celiac's...

I was in a "Celiac Crisis" and the doctor's didn't know why....

Taking both Thiamine (as the Fat Soluble B1 form of Benfotiamine) and Magnesium as either Magnesium Citrate (with meals) or Magnesium Glycinate will help restore "Normal" electrolyte levels....

Here is an article about it that explains how Hypomagnesemia (Low Magnesium) leads to Hypokalemia (Low Potassium)

Entitled "Mechanism of Hypokalemia in a Magnesium Deficiency"

https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/eea7/1b2c49c211f4b8ad2dc3b60e18fa9b4d23dd.pdf

The Low Potassium is Refractory to Low Magnesium.....treating the Low Magnesium as you did with Supplementation helped your Low Potassium levels too!

I think I mentioned this once before ONE of the most notable hospitals in our region.....didn't t know these connections between Magnesium and Potassium....

They had my friend on HIGH DOSE Potassium and wrote on his chart "WHY???"....

And after convincing my friend to take Magnesium Citrate.....he TOO!  has never had any more Potassium Issues and no  longer takes Potassium!

Magnesium is great for many things,......fatigue, muscle cramps (IE Charley Horses), sleep issues etc....when you take it  in a highly available form like Magnesium Glycinate or Magnesium Citrate!

I went years....and years without ever remembering a dream....then magically after starting Magnesium Citrate......I begin dreaming almost immediately......a sign I was now reaching REM Sleep!

I hope this is helpful but it is not medical advice.

Posterboy,

[CMCM]

2 hours ago, Posterboy said:

Wheatwacked,

NO, I mean my Blood Sugar....

I regularly test my blood sugar....it went up and stayed up for at least a week.....before now coming down again.....

The only supplement I took was the Potassium......so I know it was the Potassium.

Magnesium, in part, is how we normally  balance our Potassium levels....

I haven't had Potassium problems since I have been taking Magnesium Citrate/Glycinate....

Low Potassium levels can also be a "Symptom" of Refeeding Syndrome....in Celiac's...

I was in a "Celiac Crisis" and the doctor's didn't know why....

Taking both Thiamine (as the Fat Soluble B1 form of Benfotiamine) and Magnesium as either Magnesium Citrate (with meals) or Magnesium Glycinate will help restore "Normal" electrolyte levels....

Here is an article about it that explains how Hypomagnesemia (Low Magnesium) leads to Hypokalemia (Low Potassium)

Entitled "Mechanism of Hypokalemia in a Magnesium Deficiency"

https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/eea7/1b2c49c211f4b8ad2dc3b60e18fa9b4d23dd.pdf

The Low Potassium is Refractory to Low Magnesium.....treating the Low Magnesium as you did with Supplementation helped your Low Potassium levels too!

I think I mentioned this once before ONE of the most notable hospitals in our region.....didn't t know these connections between Magnesium and Potassium....

They had my friend on HIGH DOSE Potassium and wrote on his chart "WHY???"....

And after convincing my friend to take Magnesium Citrate.....he TOO!  has never had any more Potassium Issues and no  longer takes Potassium!

Magnesium is great for many things,......fatigue, muscle cramps (IE Charley Horses), sleep issues etc....when you take it  in a highly available form like Magnesium Glycinate or Magnesium Citrate!

I went years....and years without ever remembering a dream....then magically after starting Magnesium Citrate......I begin dreaming almost immediately......a sign I was now reaching REM Sleep!

I hope this is helpful but it is not medical advice.

Posterboy,

Magnesium CITRATE?   How about Magnesium Chloride?  Reason I ask, I've had difficulty taking magnesium, but on a doctor's recommendation I found a magnesium called Slow Mag, which is a slow release type and interestingly, it hasn't given me any problems like the others.

[Wheatwacked]

13 hours ago, Posterboy said:

The only supplement I took was the Potassium

Magnesium drives the Potassium/Sodium pump, so yeah, taking a potassium supplement without the requisite magnesium (ratio of about 11 potassium to 1 magnesium) won't do much good to the intracellular level, but I imagine it could mess with the blood electrolyte levels which could possibly explain your blood sugar. Most foods with potassium also are a source of magnesium close to 10:1 ratio, at least in the foods I eat and track. The RDA is 4700 mg potassium to 420 mg magnesium. Potassium deficiency is almost never diagnosed because our bodies, in order to maintain the critical blood K:Na ratio, will sacrifice potassium from the bones and intracellular. Reduced intracellular potassium changes the extracellular : intracellular gradient which will make it harder for the cells to transfer nutrients across the cell membrane. Maybe that is why extra magnesium works. It makes the pumps work harder to compensate. Also as a protective device, it takes 48 hours of increased dietary potassium to raise the intracellular level. Normal hips and ribs have more potassium than calcium. Maybe that's why old people after years of inadequate potassium break hips when they fall instead of arms and legs. Lowered intracellular potassium may cause reduced cell turgidity. Wrinkled skin? Potassium supplements have been linked to intestinal lesions. Finally, KCl is one of the chemicals used in chemical executions. So many national nutritional studies have found insufficient dietary potassium that it is considered a world health crisis. My point is not that magnesium supplementation is bad or not needed, it is easy to do and within reason is not dangerous, but that most people are not eating enough potassium and long term it does affect health. Hence my year long personal trial which for me proved my hypothesis: long term increased dietary potassium will reduce my blood pressure to the normal range. The only way to tell personal status other than a 24 hour urine sample (and that is only a one day snapshot) is to track daily intake.

[CMCM]

5 hours ago, Wheatwacked said:

Magnesium drives the Potassium/Sodium pump, so yeah, taking a potassium supplement without the requisite magnesium (ratio of about 11 potassium to 1 magnesium) won't do much good to the intracellular level, but I imagine it could mess with the blood electrolyte levels which could possibly explain your blood sugar. Most foods with potassium also are a source of magnesium close to 10:1 ratio, at least in the foods I eat and track. The RDA is 4700 mg potassium to 420 mg magnesium. Potassium deficiency is almost never diagnosed because our bodies, in order to maintain the critical blood K:Na ratio, will sacrifice potassium from the bones and intracellular. Reduced intracellular potassium changes the extracellular : intracellular gradient which will make it harder for the cells to transfer nutrients across the cell membrane. Maybe that is why extra magnesium works. It makes the pumps work harder to compensate. Also as a protective device, it takes 48 hours of increased dietary potassium to raise the intracellular level. Normal hips and ribs have more potassium than calcium. Maybe that's why old people after years of inadequate potassium break hips when they fall instead of arms and legs. Lowered intracellular potassium may cause reduced cell turgidity. Wrinkled skin? Potassium supplements have been linked to intestinal lesions. Finally, KCl is one of the chemicals used in chemical executions. So many national nutritional studies have found insufficient dietary potassium that it is considered a world health crisis. My point is not that magnesium supplementation is bad or not needed, it is easy to do and within reason is not dangerous, but that most people are not eating enough potassium and long term it does affect health. Hence my year long personal trial which for me proved my hypothesis: long term increased dietary potassium will reduce my blood pressure to the normal range. The only way to tell personal status other than a 24 hour urine sample (and that is only a one day snapshot) is to track daily intake.

I went through a period of time a few months back where I was getting excruciating leg cramps at night.  For a long time I would take a potassium pill when that happened and in general, it helped calm the cramps after about 30 minutes.  Later when I started more regularly taking my slow release magnesium, I didn't get the cramps again except very occasionally, mostly when I think I was dehydrated.  For awhile I was also buying the Theraworx foam to apply topically, and I believe that had magnesium in it.  It worked moderately well.  Now I  take the magnesium daily most of the time and here and there also take a potassium pill as a "just in case" type of thing.  I'm not sure what is going on with all this, but I haven't had the leg cramps for several months.  I've felt a few times like I was about to get leg cramps, but in the end it didn't really happen.   I think what I'm doing now (magnesium, occasional potassium) is working fairly well, and I haven't needed to use the Theraworx foam/cream  at all.  I must have been mineral deficient when the cramps were at their worst.

[Posterboy]

19 hours ago, CMCM said:

Magnesium CITRATE?   How about Magnesium Chloride?  Reason I ask, I've had difficulty taking magnesium, but on a doctor's recommendation I found a magnesium called Slow Mag, which is a slow release type and interestingly, it hasn't given me any problems like the others.

 

2 hours ago, CMCM said:

I went through a period of time a few months back where I was getting excruciating leg cramps at night.  For a long time I would take a potassium pill when that happened and in general, it helped calm the cramps after about 30 minutes.  Later when I started more regularly taking my slow release magnesium, I didn't get the cramps again except very occasionally, mostly when I think I was dehydrated.  For awhile I was also buying the Theraworx foam to apply topically, and I believe that had magnesium in it.  It worked moderately well.  Now I  take the magnesium daily most of the time and here and there also take a potassium pill as a "just in case" type of thing.  I'm not sure what is going on with all this, but I haven't had the leg cramps for several months.  I've felt a few times like I was about to get leg cramps, but in the end it didn't really happen.   I think what I'm doing now (magnesium, occasional potassium) is working fairly well, and I haven't needed to use the Theraworx foam/cream  at all.  I must have been mineral deficient when the cramps were at their worst.

CMCM,

Magnesium Glycinate is well tolerated.....and really is better than the Magnesium Chloride (IMHO)

Depending on the form of Magnesium Citrate LIKE Powder's.....too much Mg Citrate could cause flushing.....an urge to pass a "movement' in the first 20 to 30 minutes after taking Magnesium Citrate....

But usually only in the powder forms.....liquidgels, capsules and tablets are usually ok...

Don't ever take IT (Magnesium Citrate) in the liquid form......THEN it is sold as as laxative....with about 20x the power to trigger flushing and why it is used a  "Presurgical Flushing" tool...

Here is best article I have ever read on Magnesium Supplements...

https://www.dietvsdisease.org/best-magnesium-supplement/

Magnesium relaxes your muscles....and when we get deficient in it....our muscles can no longer relax....leading to Charley Horses aka Cramps....

When you get this low in Magnesium you are also already low in Potassium!

And taking the Magnesium (in a highly bioavailable forme) will restore your intercellular "Potassium Wasting" as Wheatwacked pointed  out so well...

The hardest part of taking Magnesium is finding one well absorbed.....which happens to be Magnesium Citrate and Magnesium Glycinate for best affect.

I switch between them often.....taking one for a while....then switching back without no side affects....

Magnesium Glycinate is harder to find....but easiest to take!

I hope this is helpful but it is not medical advice.

Posterboy,

[CMCM]

2 hours ago, Posterboy said:

 

CMCM,

Magnesium Glycinate is well tolerated.....and really is better than the Magnesium Chloride (IMHO)

Depending on the form of Magnesium Citrate LIKE Powder's.....too much Mg Citrate could cause flushing.....an urge to pass a "movement' in the first 20 to 30 minutes after taking Magnesium Citrate....

But usually only in the powder forms.....liquidgels, capsules and tablets are usually ok...

Don't ever take IT (Magnesium Citrate) in the liquid form......THEN it is sold as as laxative....with about 20x the power to trigger flushing and why it is used a  "Presurgical Flushing" tool...

Here is best article I have ever read on Magnesium Supplements...

https://www.dietvsdisease.org/best-magnesium-supplement/

Magnesium relaxes your muscles....and when we get deficient in it....our muscles can no longer relax....leading to Charley Horses aka Cramps....

When you get this low in Magnesium you are also already low in Potassium!

And taking the Magnesium (in a highly bioavailable forme) will restore your intercellular "Potassium Wasting" as Wheatwacked pointed  out so well...

The hardest part of taking Magnesium is finding one well absorbed.....which happens to be Magnesium Citrate and Magnesium Glycinate for best affect.

I switch between them often.....taking one for a while....then switching back without no side affects....

Magnesium Glycinate is harder to find....but easiest to take!

I hope this is helpful but it is not medical advice.

Posterboy,

What amounts do you find works for you?  And do you take potassium at all?

[Wheatwacked]

An adult dose of 10 oz of magnesium citrate results in a consumption of approximately 2000 mg of elemental magnesium per single dose. No wonder it works as a laxative. One ounce has 200 mg of magnesium. Slow-Mag has 143 mg per two capsules. 2 ounces of almonds has 162 mg and 440mg potassium. The magnesium RDA minimum is 420 mg. The RDA upper limit for supplemental magnesium is 350 mg. There is no upper limit for dietary magnesium.