Last Two Months...what A Roller Coaster!

[January Flower]

I think after being diagnosed two months ago, i feel like i've experienced every symptom possible. My main problem has been D. The last few days i actually feel good, for the first time in months. I really think taking probiotics and eating alot of probiotic yogurt, cheese etc is helping.

I was feeling so good i agreed to going out for a few drinks, and had a few vodka parlyzers. The next morning back to the same old D. Its so frustrating, i thought most hard alcohols were distilled enough to be okay? Anyway i guess that probably gave me the D. It seems my record is a week without D...its very frustrating.

[brendygirl]

[ Its so frustrating, i thought most hard alcohols were distilled enough to be okay? Anyway i guess that probably gave me the D. It seems my record is a week without D...its very frustrating.

[January Flower]

Thanks...next time i'll go with the SKYY vodka. We had the Silent Sam vodka. i just really wanted to have a drink!!

I'm not sure though, even before i was diagnosed it seems that hard alcohol always had a bad affect on me, just worse now!

[Tritty]

I tried to have a drink the other night - an ameretto sour. My stomach hurt for a full 24 hours after. I didn't return to the D, just pure pain. The drink was supposed to be OK - I just think my body isn't healed enough to deal yet. So I think I'm going to wait a few more months before I try again...maybe that was the issue as much as anything.

I heard Elizabeth Hasselbeck say something on the Super Bowl view show they did about potato vodka. I didn't know there was such a thing?

[wowzer]

I know that there is a potato vodka. My little sister is a celiac and that is what she gets.

[aikiducky]

Heads up - sake is NOT always safe! There can be barley in it, or used in the production process somehow.

Pauliina

[CarlaB]

Some people are bothered by distilled liquor, some are not. Potato vodka is safe because it's not made from grain. Chopin is a potato vodka ... lots of people think Belvedere is, but it's NOT, Chopin is Belvedere's potato vodka.

Smirnoff is made from corn.

[sillyakchick]

I love Vodka and crabnerry!

Here are the brands i use.

2 imported Vodkas-Luksosowa and Monopolowa are scrumptious and a lot less expensive than Chopin. There is a Korean Vodka called Green Soju that is made from sweet potatoes.

Smirnoff is made from corn. Ironically, most domestic top shelf Vodkas are not gluten free. They just cost more.

Cheers!

Heather

[kbtoyssni]

I always drink vodka when I go out. I haven't had trouble with any brands. I may be one of the lucky ones who can handle distilled alcohol. I'm wondering if it might just be the alcohol. Sometime having a few drinks will upset the digestive tract even if they are gluten-free.

[January Flower]

So Smirnoff is made from corn? So its should be safe ...what about SKYY vodka?

[Generic]

There was testing done awhile back, that if the alcohol is distilled and fermented that gluten cannot get through. The molecules are too big or something to that affect.

So based on that all hard alcohols that are distilled and fermented are safe. That is why it is safe to drink Jack Daniels, it is made out of wheat.

Most likely your stomach is not healed well yet, there fore the alcohol is upsetting it. It is not because it has gluten in it.

[ravenwoodglass]

There was testing done awhile back, that if the alcohol is distilled and fermented that gluten cannot get through. The molecules are too big or something to that affect.

So based on that all hard alcohols that are distilled and fermented are safe. That is why it is safe to drink Jack Daniels, it is made out of wheat.

Most likely your stomach is not healed well yet, there fore the alcohol is upsetting it. It is not because it has gluten in it.

-Laurie

Despite this many of us do react strongly to gluten in distilled alcohols. Some of us will even react if it is an ingredient in perfumes etc. Many can tolerate distilled but many of us can not. Only you will know whether you are one of us who does, many times it seems the folks who have neuro damage or skin effects are the ones who react strongly. Challenge alcohol like you would any suspect item and please do not assume it is safe for all just because you don't think you react.

[gfp]

There was testing done awhile back, that if the alcohol is distilled and fermented that gluten cannot get through.

Where? show me the testing....

The molecules are too big or something to that affect.

So based on that all hard alcohols that are distilled and fermented are safe. That is why it is safe to drink Jack Daniels, it is made out of wheat.

Most likely your stomach is not healed well yet, there fore the alcohol is upsetting it. It is not because it has gluten in it.

-Laurie

Unfortunatley distillation doesn't work like that... its just the way its taught at undergrad chemistry but in the real world and post doc research it's really nothing like that...

The actual chemistry is pretty involved... so an easy way to look at it is....

Size is pretty much immaterial.... alcohol is much bigger than water... but it evaporates at a lower temp...

or another way.. water boils at 100C or 212F ? but it doesn't, it actually boils way below zero C ... its just on average it boils at 100C... when you see steam coming off ice you are seeing water boiling...

Its unfortunate that the explanation is so compex... but unless you know quantum mechanics all I can really do is give examples...

The bottom line is easy though.. some of us react to distilled grains ONLY... not uncolored cognac or potatoe vodka ... indeed I have a few illegal bottles of hooch from pure sugar and also potatoes... and I don't react to these or wine .. so something must be getting through... the process.... I wish I could explain it simply but the science is pretty advanced and I even asked a friend who specialises in this as a post doc (he also lectures) and he couldn't come up with a way to explain it to people with college chemistry.

[darlindeb25]

Here is an interesting site for those of you who would like to know which alcohol is considered gluten free. It gives descriptions of the different drinks and what they contain: Open Original Shared Link

Personally, I am like many other celiac's who just cannot tolerate any alcohol. A tiny drink of wine makes me very ill, peachtree schnapps is my favorite and I can't touch it. I read somewhere that it may have something to do with damage done to our livers by gluten, which makes total sense to me. I just know, that even if the alcohol is gluten free, I can't have it. Good thing I was never a drinker anyways!

[Mtndog]

I DO react to grain based vodka so I stick with Smirnoff (corn) and Chopin (potato) when I'm feeling rich. I do notice that I don't feel so "wuggy" the next day with Chopin even if I over-indulge a bit.

Vodka can give you D (I'm sure any alcohol can) but when I first went gluten-free I was told no alcohol for 6 months.

[Generic]

O.k. guys don't shoot the messenger. I cannot find the research at this moment. I think I read it in a book, can't remember off the top of my head but here is an example to back up what I said. Here is from celiac.com's own page. https://www.celiac.com/st_prod.html?p_prodi...-23106011054.bc

Celiac.com 12/10/2000 - As reported in Ann Whelan's September/October issue of Gluten-Free Living, the American Dietetic Association (ADA) has released the 6th edition of its Manual of Clinical Dietetics, which offers revised guidelines for the treatment of celiac disease. This manual is currently used by hospitals and doctors all over North America, and represents the most up-to-date source of information with regard to the dietary treatment of various illnesses. The new standards set in this publication conform more closely with current international standards. Included on their safe list are items that have been on Celiac.com's safe list for over five years, including: amaranth, buckwheat, distilled vinegar (no matter what its source), distilled alcoholic beverages (including rum, gin, whiskey and vodka), millet, quinoa and teff.

Open Original Shared Link

Alcohol and vinegar that are properly distilled should not contain any harmful gluten peptides (or prolomines). Research indicates that the gluten peptide is too large to carry over in the distillation process. This leaves the resultant liquid gluten-free unless a gluten-containing additive is inserted after the distillation process. Alcohols and vinegars should be carefully investigated for additives before use. Malt vinegars are not distilled and therefore are not gluten-free.

Open Original Shared Link

Alcohol that's properly distilled shouldn't contain any harmful gluten. Research indicates that the peptide is too large to carry over in the distillation process. Beer is a definite no-no. You might want to consider staying away from alcohol altogether (like the author of this site). This might seem drastic to some but our health is at stake. Wine from the Liquor store might bother your stomach, like it does mine possibly because of Sulfites as preserative to give it a longer shelf life. Home made Wine wthout any added ingredients in moderation seems to be O.K.

[Generic]

I also found this on the board.

https://www.celiac.com/st_prod.html?p_prodi...-49107222692.3c

Please note that ingredients in the products on this page are subject to change without notice. The products on this page were safe when last checked. It is up to you to verify that the product remains gluten-free by checking the ingredients yourself, or by contacting the manufacturer. All distilled alcohols are gluten-free.

* Armagnac - made from grapes.

* Bourbon - Makers Mark

* Brandy

* Champagne

* Cider - fermented from apples or other fruits. Some are safe, however, many add barley for enzymes and flavor.

o Old Deadly Cider

* Cognac - made from grapes.

* Gin

* Grappa

* Kahlua

* Kirschwasser (cherry liqueur)

* Margarita Mix:

o Jose Cuervo.

o Mr. & Mrs. "T".

* Martini:

o Club Extra Dry Martini (corn & grape).

o Club Vodka Martini (corn & grape).

* Mead - distilled from honey.

* Mistico:

o Jose Cuervo Mistico (agave and cane).

* Mixes & Cooking Alcohol:

o Club Tom Collins (corn).

o Dimond Jim's Bloody Mary Mystery.

o Holland House - all EXCEPT Teriyaki Marinade and Smooth & Spicy Bloody Mary Mixes.

o Mr. & Mrs. "T" - all Except Bloody Mary Mix.

o Spice Islands - Cooking Wines - Burgundy, Sherry and White.

* Ouzo - made from grapes and anise.

* Rum

* Sake - fermented with rice and Koji enzymes. The Koji enzymes are grown on Miso, which is usually made with barley. The two-product separation from barley, and the manufacturing process should make it safe for celiacs.

* Scotch Whiskey

* Sherry

* Sparkling Wine

* Tequila

* Vermouth - distilled from grapes.

* Vodka

* Wine - all wines, including port wines and sherry, are safe for celiacs.

* Wine Coolers:

o Bartle & James - their wine-based beverages (EXCEPT their malt beverages - read the label carefully!).

o Boone's - their wine-based beverages (EXCEPT their malt beverages - read the label carefully!)

This is from the gluten intolerance group of north america.

Open Original Shared Link

[mikeanway]

I think after being diagnosed two months ago, i feel like i've experienced every symptom possible. My main problem has been D. The last few days i actually feel good, for the first time in months. I really think taking probiotics and eating alot of probiotic yogurt, cheese etc is helping.

I was feeling so good i agreed to going out for a few drinks, and had a few vodka parlyzers. The next morning back to the same old D. Its so frustrating, i thought most hard alcohols were distilled enough to be okay? Anyway i guess that probably gave me the D. It seems my record is a week without D...its very frustrating.

In the distilling process gluten is supposed to be too big to get into the final product,but everyone is different in how it reacts. But maybe it was something else in the drink? There is one Potato Vodka I know of..

Open Original Shared Link made here in America, in Rigby, Idaho

[gfp]

O.k. guys don't shoot the messenger. I cannot find the research at this moment. I think I read it in a book, can't remember off the top of my head but here is an example to back up what I said. Here is from celiac.com's own page. https://www.celiac.com/st_prod.html?p_prodi...-23106011054.bc

Celiac.com 12/10/2000 - As reported in Ann Whelan's September/October issue of Gluten-Free Living, the American Dietetic Association (ADA) has released the 6th edition of its Manual of Clinical Dietetics, which offers revised guidelines for the treatment of celiac disease. This manual is currently used by hospitals and doctors all over North America, and represents the most up-to-date source of information with regard to the dietary treatment of various illnesses. The new standards set in this publication conform more closely with current international standards. Included on their safe list are items that have been on Celiac.com's safe list for over five years, including: amaranth, buckwheat, distilled vinegar (no matter what its source), distilled alcoholic beverages (including rum, gin, whiskey and vodka), millet, quinoa and teff.

Open Original Shared Link

Alcohol and vinegar that are properly distilled should not contain any harmful gluten peptides (or prolomines). Research indicates that the gluten peptide is too large to carry over in the distillation process. This leaves the resultant liquid gluten-free unless a gluten-containing additive is inserted after the distillation process. Alcohols and vinegars should be carefully investigated for additives before use. Malt vinegars are not distilled and therefore are not gluten-free.

Open Original Shared Link

Alcohol that's properly distilled shouldn't contain any harmful gluten. Research indicates that the peptide is too large to carry over in the distillation process. Beer is a definite no-no. You might want to consider staying away from alcohol altogether (like the author of this site). This might seem drastic to some but our health is at stake. Wine from the Liquor store might bother your stomach, like it does mine possibly because of Sulfites as preserative to give it a longer shelf life. Home made Wine wthout any added ingredients in moderation seems to be O.K.

-Laurie

Unfortunately I have to call BS....(not on you on the "papers')

You can't (in a scientific paper just say "current research indicates" you must site the paper, publication and authors... and that paper should contain the original methods and analytic process.... etc.

Unfortunately its not uncommon in general but especially in quasi-science like medicine where most doctors don't really understand science. Indeed this method was pionerred more or less by the tobacco companies... where they would conduct studies indicating "current research show tobacco doesn't cause ....<>"

The problem is that this sort of myth propogates easily because noone ever sites the original source... they think the other person must have actually read it... hence the citation principle for scientific papers being compulsary... it doesn't mean they don't mean well. it just means they never did the research themself nor saw anyone elses research... they just saw people mention other research and presume they must have seen it....

If size had ANYTHING to do with distillation then you could mix fuel oil and water and the fuel oil would be too large to "carry over in the distillation process." ... try it, its not yet its many times larger than water!

This basic paper explains the actual process of distillation...

Note:

References

1. Abd el-Qade r, Z., Hallett, W .L.H. Combustio n Inst. Canadian Sect. 2000 Meeting, 42-1 - 4 2-6

2. Tam im, J., Ha llett, W.L .H., Chem. Eng. Science 50, 2933-2942 (19 95).

3. Hallett, W .L.H., Combustion & Flame 121, 334-344 (2000 ).

4. Talley, D.G., Y ao, S.C., 21st Symp. (Int.) on Combustion, 609-616 (1986 ).

Open Original Shared Link

[gfp]

All distilled alcohols are gluten-free.

Cite your source ...

It is up to you to verify that the product remains gluten-free by checking the ingredients yourself, or by contacting the manufacturer.

You know since I moved my appartment is too small to have a LCMS .. how do you suggest I verify this?

[larry mac]

.....

You know since I moved my appartment is too small to have a LCMS .....

gfp is referring to a laboratory instrument, actually a combination of two instruments. LC/MS - combines liquid chromatographic separation with mass spectrometric detection. We used to have a GCMS at Core Labs (for oil & gas analysis). Both are very expensive and require specialized training. It's definately not like on those TV shows.

best regards, lm

[Mtndog]

gfp- you definitely know more about this than the average person and I know you said size doesn't matter (of the molecules! ) but one of the lines that caught my attention is the one that said if the alcohol is "PROPERLY" distilled. Maybe that's the problem? Don't know, but still won't drink anything distilled from grain!

Until I get a LCMS! Wish you had a little chemistry kit you could carry around with you to take samples from what you're about to eat to detect gluten.

[CarlaB]

but one of the lines that caught my attention is the one that said if the alcohol is "PROPERLY" distilled.

This could be why some distilled alcohol bothers some people.

I know that they also say that wheat grass and barley grass has no gluten in it. Theoretically this is probably true, but they both sure make me sick! I would say it's the same for distillation, it's just not a perfect process. It probably depends how sensitive you actually are.

[Generic]

Well I honestly can say, that I am one of the most sensitive people out there. I have the numerous trips to the E.R. to prove it. I have never had a problem from alcohol, other than when I drank too much, LOL. Hangover, and yes the stomach does get upset with it, that is a normal reaction. It is not a gluten induced stomach upset either.

If it isn't possible then perhaps the GIG of North America and Scott shouldn't post such things. I believe them to be reliable sources of valuable information.

As a side note alcohol is a poison to the body. Could it be possible that some people just don't tolerate alcohol regardless of the source? People react to things differently. What might cause a person a great buzz to alcohol can cause another a nasty mood and a hangover to boot.

Just a thought.

[ravenwoodglass]

Could it be possible that some people just don't tolerate alcohol regardless of the source? People react to things differently. What might cause a person a great buzz to alcohol can cause another a nasty mood and a hangover to boot.

Just a thought.

-Laurie

There are many things that are not known about celiac. While it is true that there are sites, including this one, that state that all distilled are fine there are also reliable sites such as the Celiac Sprue Association that state clearly that distilled grain alcohols are not okay for a zero gluten tolerance diet.

Open Original Shared Link

I know the difference quite well between a hangover and a glutening. And by the way I have never even gotten a hangover from potato vodka or other non gluten grain alcohol even when I have clearly had to much. Just 1 grain based drink will make me very, very ill. Complete with DH blisters and all other clear indications of a glutening.

You may not react and that is fine but we need to avoid blanket safety statements for anything. We are all different and have different tolerances.