Not Sure If This Is Dh? Opinions Much Needed Pls.

[lilhanksmama]

my son has been diagnosed as a suspected celiac and has done much better on a gluten-free diet. we are very strict about it but kids being kids... he will put things in his mouth that he finds on the ground occasionally, or put a finger in his mouth after playing on playground equipment etc. (he is under 2 yrs old)

he has been suffering terribly from a rash on his arms, legs and back for months. it gets worse and somewhat better but never goes away. the dr. thinks it's ecxema but i'm not convinced. i have suffered with ecxema for my whole life and it just doesn't look like the rashes that he seems to get. i would like to post a pic or two and see what you all think. thanks in advance... our next apt. with the doc is on wednesday.

(i am also not sure why my pics aren't working... is it because i am new?)

[ravenwoodglass]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v139/squ.../henryrash1.webp

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v139/squ.../henryrash2.webp

(i am also not sure why my pics aren't working... is it because i am new?)

I was able to access the pictures by dropping the bracets and the img from the link.

Your poor boy he must be really miserable, and yes those photos do look like DH. Make sure if he is going to see a dermatologist that they are familiar with DH. If they should choose to biospy be right there and make sure that they biopsy beside an active lesion and not the lesion itself. Although there really isn't much they can do other than tell you to make him gluten free. I would be very cautious if they should prescribe dapsone, maybe I shouldn't say this but the drug does have a liver impact and I myself would never take it let alone give it to a young child. This may be a moot point as I don't know if it is even approved for use in children that young.

There has got to be some gluten sneaking in somewhere, have you eliminated it from not just his toiletries but also yours? Is your home gluten-free? If not you may need to make it so. Could gluten be sneaking in from treats or something that someone else is giving him? It can be really hard to figure out what is getting us and when we have DH we are sooooo very sensitive. The good thing about DH is that as time goes by he will lose the deposits in his skin and eventually the reaction will be much milder, but it can take a long time.

[RiceGuy]

I agree. Sure looks like DH to me also.

As for where the gluten may be coming from, seems to me kids that age spend a lot of time on the floor, and flour dust, bread crumbs, etc always end up on the floor too, even if you can't see it.

That being said, I had some DH for a long while even after going gluten-free. Plus, as I understand it, DH never actually goes away completely, just subsides, and over time may not show itself very often. What helped me was to limit salt and proteins to minimal amounts, until my absorption was sufficient enough for those things not to pose such a problem.

Lastly, since eczema is also a known symptom of Celiac, if you aren't already gluten-free, I'd encourage you to do so. Not to mention that Celiac is hereditary, so your little one got it from someone...

[jeannine]

That looks a lot like dh. I was diagnosed with dh after having the rash for 18 months. I have been gluten-free for about 3 weeks, but was told by my derm that it could easily take a year for it to go away. Dapsone is not an option for me (and I'm sure it would not be for your ds, either) so I was given lidocaine (sp) which is topical and numbs the rash so I don't scratch it. Also keep your son's nails very short. I sleep with gloves on to keep me from scratching while sleeping (though I usually wake up glove-free).

Jeannine

[lilhanksmama]

thanks so much for the replies everyone. that's what i thought as well. i will ask the dr. to take another look and really check it out. i also kept the digital pics on my camera because sometimes when you make an appt with the doc, by the time you see them, the flare up doesn't look the same. i will show him the pics too.

we are running a gluten-free diet for myself, my older daughter and my son. as a matter of fact, the ONLY gluten that comes into our house in any form unless tracked in on someone else is my hubby's bread for his sandwiches which he keeps isolated in the freezer, has his own private toaster stored in a plastic bag in it's own cupboard and some granola... same rules.

i was wondering how long the outbreaks can last after going gluten-free so thanks for some insight into that. my poor lil guy will scratch until he has blood pouring down his arms and legs if we don't stop him and NOTHING seems to help at all. i asked the pharmacist and she suggested oatmeal bath. i wouldn't put a celiac into a bath of oatmeal!

the doc says that you cannot be gluten-ed by touching a glutinous laden surface but i disagree... the worst my son has ever reacted was after playing in a slide and climber at McDonalds... before we knew better. he didn't eat there or anything.

i could use lots of advice and suggestions on this from all you pros. we have to figure out where it's coming from. could be playground... i read all of our toiletries and contact the 1-800 numbers on products all the time. i make gluten-free play clay and paints... i run a gluten-free daycare in my home too.

thanks again.

[ravenwoodglass]

"i asked the pharmacist and she suggested oatmeal bath. i wouldn't put a celiac into a bath of oatmeal!"

That was what my Mom used to do for me, and we wondered why I never was without a breakout. Of course we thought it was poison ivy. My Mom had the exact same rash as a kid growing up on a farm her mother used to scrub the blisters with a scrub brush and then pour salt on them to dry them up. Can you imagine! It wasss 1920 but geez.

You may want to try a milk bath. Put him in a lukewarm tub with about a half gallon of whole milk added, unless he has an allergy or intolerance to milk, of course. Cool compresses also help a bit. I hope this clears up soon for him.

[ellen123]

"i was wondering how long the outbreaks can last after going gluten-free so thanks for some insight into that. my poor lil guy will scratch until he has blood pouring down his arms and legs if we don't stop him and NOTHING seems to help at all. i asked the pharmacist and she suggested oatmeal bath. i wouldn't put a celiac into a bath of oatmeal!"

Try black tea teabags to relieve your son's itching. I read this suggestion on another thread on this forum -- someone suggested taking a cool black tea bath, but I've been appying moistened teabags directly to my rash and it really seems to alleviate the itching for quite a while -- enough to allow me to sleep. Apparently the tannin is supposed to soothe the rash.

Good luck! Ellen

[RoseTapper]

I agree that when we touch products that contain gluten, we can experience DH. Some products, though, are difficult to identify whether or not they are gluten-free. For example, I was experiencing a terrible outbreak of DH, so I started looking into all of my makeup supplies, toiletries, supplements, etc., to try to find the source. It turned out that even though my shampoo did not list wheat germ on it, all of the other shampoos in the same "line" listed wheat germ in them....so either the company goofed and left off any mention of wheat germ OR the shampoo was contaminated because it was produced on the same equipment. I now use a shampoo that specifically states "gluten free" on it.

As for where your son may be getting contaminated, is it possible that someone is kissing your baby (like a grandma or a friend) who is wearing lipstick? Lipstick is loaded with gluten. Just a thought.

[CtheCeliac]

Yes, I got the initial exzema response from a physician, too. One advantage I have (and my brother, who's a Celiac, too) is now that we've been gluten-free for over a year, we can tell when we've been glutened if we get a small outbreak. That's usually his first reaction.

[lilhanksmama]

thanks so much for the info everyone... it's greatly appreciated.

yeh, the wheat in shampoos or conditioners is one i had overlooked at first... oops, and there i was bathing my little boy in a tub that i had showered my conditioner out in.

we saw the doc again and he maintains that he feels that it's eczema. the first round of treatments for the "infected eczema" didn't work at all but the betamethazone cream prescribed this time seems to be helping with some of it... so it could possibly be eczema or it could be a mix of both.

the tea bag trick definitely helps, thanks!

[ravenwoodglass]

thanks so much for the info everyone... it's greatly appreciated.

yeh, the wheat in shampoos or conditioners is one i had overlooked at first... oops, and there i was bathing my little boy in a tub that i had showered my conditioner out in.

we saw the doc again and he maintains that he feels that it's eczema. the first round of treatments for the "infected eczema" didn't work at all but the betamethazone cream prescribed this time seems to be helping with some of it... so it could possibly be eczema or it could be a mix of both.

the tea bag trick definitely helps, thanks!

So glad you found something that helps. One other thing you may want to do is put cotton mittens on him when he sleeps, if he will tolerate it. It can help if he itches while he sleeps. I hope he is all healed up soon.

[dally099]

hi, ouch i think it looks like DH how awfull for him and you. i would really get a new doc, there are people on here who can help you from your area find one that will listen to you better. watch out for baby products, lots of them are loaded with oatmeal and oat brans. good luck with him!

[monkeypuss]

aww poor love i've got a rash thats unconfirmed what it is yet, although my doc says it looks just like DH which looks exactly like what your little boys got :/ i just have it on the backs of my elbows tho, must be awful for you and your son i hope he starts to get better soon..I had a bad rash when i was a kid all down my leg and my ankle and i'm wondering now if that was maybe DH...looked the same as whats on my elbows and i remember saying it looked and felt different to the eczema i'd had before cos it was so much more itchy and more like little bumps and scabs...i used to put the labels from my dr pepper bottles over the wounds to stop my school trousers from getting stuck in my leg..thinking back, that probably wasnt the best method! lol telling my mum would have been the best

so i was wondering about this shampoo thing, its got me wondering now, will it say wheat in the ingredients? or will it be under some other name? i just checked my shampoos and it all just sounds like chemicals....:/ also does anyone know of a good gluten free shampoo thats good for coloured hair? ohh and while i'm on the topic, does anyone know if hair dyes themselves have gluten in at all? I dyed my hair with a different brand last time and since i've had weird super itchy blisters behind my ears that leak sorta like clear oil...i get them on my fingers usually might not be anything to do with DH tho :/

[ravenwoodglass]

so i was wondering about this shampoo thing, its got me wondering now, will it say wheat in the ingredients? or will it be under some other name? i just checked my shampoos and it all just sounds like chemicals....:/ also does anyone know of a good gluten free shampoo thats good for coloured hair? ohh and while i'm on the topic, does anyone know if hair dyes themselves have gluten in at all? I dyed my hair with a different brand last time and since i've had weird super itchy blisters behind my ears that leak sorta like clear oil...i get them on my fingers usually might not be anything to do with DH tho :/

Actually the reaction to your scalp does sound like a DH reaction. There are some good gluten-free shampoos but it can be really hard to tell by the labels on some brands. Dove will clearly label gluten sources such as wheat and oat as will Suave. For the Organics Giovanni makes some great products for the hair but I haven't checked their skin care line. Burt's Bees makes some nice stuff also.

Hair Dye can also be a problem, I used to use Herbatint, it is made in Italy and I got it at both Wegmans and my local health food store also ordered it for me. They also have a website if memory serves me.

There is a great makeup that there is a long thread on in the Products section, you should check that out. If you have a particular product in you cabinet that you want to find out about first call the number on the bottle and ask if there is any wheat or oats or any of their chemical derivitives. That will get you a better answer than asking if it is gluten free. Or post a query on the products thread and see if any of us know if it is or not.

[lilhanksmama]

aww poor love i've got a rash thats unconfirmed what it is yet, although my doc says it looks just like DH which looks exactly like what your little boys got :/ i just have it on the backs of my elbows tho, must be awful for you and your son i hope he starts to get better soon..I had a bad rash when i was a kid all down my leg and my ankle and i'm wondering now if that was maybe DH...looked the same as whats on my elbows and i remember saying it looked and felt different to the eczema i'd had before cos it was so much more itchy and more like little bumps and scabs...i used to put the labels from my dr pepper bottles over the wounds to stop my school trousers from getting stuck in my leg..thinking back, that probably wasnt the best method! lol telling my mum would have been the best

so i was wondering about this shampoo thing, its got me wondering now, will it say wheat in the ingredients? or will it be under some other name? i just checked my shampoos and it all just sounds like chemicals....:/ also does anyone know of a good gluten free shampoo thats good for coloured hair? ohh and while i'm on the topic, does anyone know if hair dyes themselves have gluten in at all? I dyed my hair with a different brand last time and since i've had weird super itchy blisters behind my ears that leak sorta like clear oil...i get them on my fingers usually might not be anything to do with DH tho :/

dr pepper labels stuck to your wounds to keep your pants from sticking?! poor you!! i remember i had that same thing up and down the backs of my legs as a kid too. dr. said exzema but it never cleared up with any of the treatments... only got marginally better in winter. finally cleared up when i was about 20 or so.

don't quote me on this but as a hairdresser, but i am pretty sure that there is no wheat and/or gluten in professional products. i see that itchy blister thing from hair color every so often... and it is usually either an intolerance to the chemicals or an over-processing with chemicals. especially if the sores appeared right at the same time as the color was on and not days later. can be an allergy to anyline derivitives (a petro-chemical... quite charming!) it's also possible that the chemicals removed any kind of protective barrier from your skin and made it hyper sensitive and then you washed your hair with a shampoo that contains gluten... allowing for penetration of the product.

good luck and thanks for all the advice/concerns for poor lil bubby. his rash finally cleared up -- for 3 days and now it is sneaking back again.

[Lisa16]

There actually can be gluten in professional hair care products. Aveda, for example, sent me a list of their professional products that contain gluten and it had many dyes and chemical treatments on there. And if they have it, then others can too.

I posted the list in the "gluten-free products" thread about a month ago. The hair products issue is really thorny.

Good luck with your baby! I would add that it is really hard to photograph the DH rash, but you did a good job. It certainly could be DH.

[Lisa16]

Here is the AVEDA list of products to avoid. Notice especially the "one color" products which contain wheat germ glycerides.

GLUTEN REFERENCE GUIDE

These are the products Aveda manufactures containing gluten.

Please be aware, customers that are gluten sensitive may also be sensitive to trace amounts that may be in the processing,

packaging, or packing surface of a product.

Any customer that is gluten sensitive may want to consult a physician prior to use of the product.

REV. 12 April 2006

WHEAT

DISODIUM WHEAT GERMAMIDO PEG-2 SULFOSUCCINATE

CALMING LIQUID CLEANSER

ENERGIZING LIQUID CLEANSER

SHAMPURE SHAMPOO

WHEAT AMINO ACIDS (and) HYDROXYPROPYLTRIMONIUM WHEAT PROTEIN (and)

HYDROLYZED BRAZIL NUT PROTEIN

55% VOC FIRMATA

COLOR CONSERVE POST-COLOR TREATMENT (NOT LAUNCHED AS OF 4/12/05)

CONFIXOR

CURESSENCE CONDITIONER

CURESSENCE SHAMPOO

DAMAGE REMEDY EQULIZING SOLUTION

SHAMPURE CONDITIONER (+ Japan)

SHAMPURE SHAMPOO (+ Japan)

STYLING CURESSENCE

WHEAT AMINO ACIDS (and) HYDROLYZED BRAZIL NUT PROTEIN

COLOR CONSERVE POST-COLOR TREATMENT (NOT LAUNCHED AS OF 4/12/05)

CURESSENCE CONDITIONER

CURESSENCE SHAMPOO

SHAMPURE CONDITIONER

SHAMPURE SHAMPOO (+ Japan)

STYLING CURESSENCE

WHEAT AMINO ACIDS

BLACK MALVA SHAMPOO

BLUE MALVA SHAMPOO

CAMOMILE SHAMPOO

CLOVE SHAMPOO

ELIXIR

ELIXIR REMEDY

MADDER ROOT SHAMPOO

ROSEMARY MINT CONDITIONER

SAP MOSS CONDITIONER (+ Japan)

SAP MOSS NOURISHING CONCENTRATE

VOLUMIZING TONIC

Wheat Cont. STEARDIMONIUM HYDROXYPROPYL HYDROLYZED WHEAT PROTEIN

AIR CONTROL

ALL SENSITIVE SHAMPOO *DISCONTINUED

ANNATTO COLOR CONDITIONER

BIXA COLOR CONDITIONER

BLACK MALVA COLOR CONDITIONER

BLUE MALVA COLOR CONDITIONER

CAMOMILE COLOR CONDITIONER

CHERRY ALMOND BARK

CLOVE COLOR CONDITIONER

CUTICLE CONTROL

DAMAGE REMEDY STREGNTHENING AND REPARATIVE TREATMENT

DEEP PENETRATING HAIR REVITALIZER

ELIXIR REMEDY

MADDER ROOT COLOR CONDITIONER

PERSONAL BLENDS CONDITIONER

PURE ABUNDANCE VOLUMIZING HAIR SPRAY

SO MILD WAVING LOTION

STRONG WILLED WAVING LOTION

VOLUMIZING FINISHER *DISCONTINUED

VOLUMIZING TONIC

HYDROLYZED WHEAT PROTEIN

BE CURLY

ROSEMARY MINT HAND AND BODY CLEANSER

HYDROLYZED WHEAT PROTEIN/PVP CROSSPOLYMER

HANG STRAIGHT

HYDROLYZED WHEAT PROTEIN (and) HYDROLYZED WHEAT STARCH

ALL SENSITIVE CONDITIONER *DISCONTINUED

ANNATTO COLOR CONDITIONER

BIXA COLOR CONDITIONER

BLACK MALVA COLOR CONDITIONER

BLUE MALVA COLOR CONDITIONER

CAMOMILE COLOR CONDITIONER

CLOVE COLOR CONDITIONER

COLOR CONSERVE CONDITIONER JAPAN only

CONTROL TAPE

DAMAGE REMEDY EQUILIZING SOLUTION

DAMAGE REMEDY STRENGTHENING AND REPARATIVE TREATMENT

DANDRUFF REMEDY *DISCONTINUED

ELIXIR REMEDY

MADDER ROOT COLOR CONDITIONER

PERSONAL BLENDS CONDITIONER

PURE ABUNDANCE CLAY CONDITIONER

PURE ABUNDANCE SHAMPOO

Wheat Cont. HYDROLYZED WHEAT PROTEIN (and) HYDROLYZED WHEAT STARCH

PUREFUME BRILLIANT DAMAGE CONTROL

PUREFUME BRILLIANT RETEXTURING GEL

SAP MOSS CONDITIONING DETANGLER

SAP MOSS NOURISHING CONCENTRATE

SAP MOSS STYLING SPRAY

SCALP REMEDY

HYDROLYZED WHEAT PROTEIN PG-PROPYL SILANETRIOL

COLOR CONSERVE CONDITIONER

COLOR CONSERVE FOAM LEAVE-IN CONDITIONER

HANG STRAIGHT

LIGHT ELEMENTS REVIVING MIST

PUREFUME BRILLIANT RETEXTURING GEL

SHAMPURE CONDITIONER ( + Japan)

WHEAT GERM GLYCERIDES

ONECOLOR PLUS TWO BALANCED BURGUNDY

ONECOLOR PLUS TWO BOMBAY PURPLE

ONECOLOR PLUS TWO CHAI

ONECOLOR PLUS TWO CHAOTIC COPPER

ONECOLOR PLUS TWO GOLD AWAKENING

ONECOLOR PLUS TWO GREEN TEA

ONECOLOR PLUS TWO HERBAN PLUM

ONECOLOR PLUS TWO INDIGENOUS BROWN

ONECOLOR PLUS TWO JILABI GOLD

ONECOLOR PLUS TWO LUNAR WHITE

ONECOLOR PLUS TWO NEUTRAL EXPERIENCE

ONECOLOR PLUS TWO OSLO SHEEN

ONECOLOR PLUS TWO SOLAR WHITE

ONECOLOR PLUS TWO SUMATRA

WHEAT GERM EXTRACT

BLUE GEL BALANCING MASSAGE BLEND

ALL - COOLING CALMING COLOR *DISCONTINUED

ALL - COOLING CALMING COVER *DISCONTINUED

TOURMALINE CHARGED HYDRATING CR�ME

TRITICUM VULGARE (WHEAT) GLUTEN EXTRACT/WATER

LIP COLOR CONCENTRATE SPF 15 - ALL SHADES

LIP GLAZE - ALL SHADES

LIP REPLENISHMENT

LIP SHEER CONCENTRATE SPF 15 - ALL SHADES

URUKU LIP SATIN - ALL SHADES

URUKU LIP SHEER - ALL SHADES

OAT

AVENA SATIVA

SPA SMOOTHING BODY SCRUB

OAT (AVENA SATIVA) FLOUR

HERBAL SCIENCE REMEDY

OAT (AVENA SATIVA) BRAN EXTRACT

ALL SENSITIVE CONDITIONER *DISCONTINUED

BALANCING INFUSION FOR SENSITIVE SKIN

NIGHT NUTRIENTS

PUREFUME BRILLIANT CONDITIONER

SHAMPURE CONDITIONER Japan only

OAT (AVENA SATIVA) BRAN

ALL SENSTIVE CONDITIONER *DISCONTINUED

OAT (AVENA SATIVA) PROTEIN

FIRMING FLUID

ONECOLOR PLUS URUKU *DISCONTINUED

MILLET

PANICUM MILIACEUM( MILLET ) SEED FLOUR

CARIBBEAN THERAPY PLANT POWDER CONCENTRATE

HERBAL SCIENCE REMEDY

SEA SCIENCE REMEDY

MILLET (PANICUM MILIACEUM) SEED EXTRACT

NIGHT NUTRIENTS

RYE NONE

BARLEY

SANTALUM ALBUM (SANDALWOOD) EXTRACT/ PHELLODENDRON &

AMURENSE BARK EXTRACT/HORDEUM DISTICHON (BARLEY) EXTRACT

DAMAGE REMEDY CONDITIONER

DAMAGE REMEDY EQUALIZING SOLUTION

DAMAGE REMEDY MOISTURE IMMERSION

DAMAGE REMEDY SHAMPOO

DAMAGE REMEDY STRENGTHENING & REPARATIVE TREATMENT

DAMAGE REMEDY TREATMENT

[RoseTapper]

Since shampoo companies aren't required to list all ingredients, it's difficult to know if a shampoo/conditioner contains gluten. Wheat germ and Vitamin E are common ingredients, too. Therefore, I use only a shampoo/conditioner that says "gluten free," and the brand I use is Dessert Essence Organics. They have a whole line of gluten-free shampoos/conditioners, so I think there may be one for hair that's been color-treated.

[purple]

I never saw the pics or read the posts but you could check out "chicken skin" (kertosis pilaris) and see if any pics and info match. My daughter has it and I am sure its caused by gluten so we are going gluten-free with her. She ate biscuits and it felt like she had spiders crawling on her arms. Just lots of pokey, itchy bumps that won't go away.