Specific Carbohydrate Diet (SCD)

[mftnchn]

I've also had some trouble with reactions to foods at times and okay at other times. I think it is more consistent now on the SCD. Of course some problems were eliminated by the diet, and a few other things I know to avoid. But I do think that the diet has made a difference.

[GermanMia]

My naturopth explained that because of a leaky gut the body developes pseudo-allergies with random symptoms which you never can predict. Actually that histamine intolerance is kind of pseudo-allergy, too. So that should go away as soon as the gut heals, I suppose. Maybe there are people more sensitive to histamine than others who just have to avoid those histamine provoking food for a while to cool the body's reactions down a bit.

[DMarie]

So now I am a little confused as I look at two issues (SCD and histamine intolerance).

My responses to food are random. A couple of weeks ago I ate a handful of cashews one day, and my stomach hurt after. Yet, since then I have had cashews - and not a problem. This morning I ate pumpkin waffles (used buckwheat, sorghum and a little bit of tapioca flours) and I had a slight headache, stomache ache and mucous which kicked in about 20 minutes after I ate, and lasted for about 30 minutes. Yet I have eaten those previously with no problems whatsoever. I did notice on a food list for histamine containing foods that pumpkin, buckwheat and cinnamon were no-no's (and this recipe uses all 3).

Additionally, the other night I ate something that was primarily corn (after dropping corn for the past several weeks). I was bummed, and just ate it (which is unlike me, I normally don't have problems leaving alone what I have decided to leave alone.) I expected to feel really bad. Nope. I did have a mild headache, but all in all, a lesser reaction than I have had at other times.

So, what do I do here? I will ask my doctor about the histamine intolerance when I see her (found a good article off of a medical journal website). It would seem that a histamine avoidance diet and the SCD conflict. I don't know how to reconcile this as I am new to both worlds of thought. Also, I take zyrtec daily (which is an antihistamine). I am not sure how/if this fits in.

[GermanMia]

Hi Dawn,

if you already take an antihistamine, it's not very likely that your reactions are caused by histamine intolerance. Not impossible, but usually an antihistamine should suppress reactions to histamine.

So it might be what is said about leaky gut: that you show random reactions to everything now and then and can't predict the reactions. And this is why one should start with the intro of the SCD. It's only a limited number of foods which usually don't bother the gut too much. You start with these and wait until your system starts to calm down, then you introduce the other foods, step by step, as slowly or fast as your system can tolerate.

[mftnchn]

Dawn,

My reactions were also rather random like that. Almost impossible to figure it out and very frustrating to figure out a diet. This has settled down quite a bit so far on SCD. I have more trouble with harder to digest foods. (Cashews are very hard to digest, btw).

I can only guess at the reason. I suspect my leaky gut issues were being exacerbated by my inability to break down carbohydrate (I tested with high levels of sugar in stool indicating I lacked the enzymes to digest carbs). It was feeding bad bacteria and parasites and destroying the intestinal lining, also keeping my gut from healing from celiac even though I had been strictly gluten-free 15 months and SF almost a year.

Buckwheat, sorghum, tapioca flours, and corn are all things you would give up on SCD (at least until you heal). They were all things I was eating before, and even tested okay with energetic testing (except corn). So I don't think I was truly allergic, but just cannot break them down.

[fig girl]

Fig girl,

I had no sore specks but kind of neurodermitis all over - barely visible, but my skin (especially the face) and my head were itching all the time. Only some days ago I realised the itching is nearly gone!

[fig girl]

Fig Girl - Gracie is our newest rescue. Can you believe someone dumped her and left her for dead, starving on the side of the road? She is like show quality and the sweetest lovingest kissiest doggie ever.

I just ordered Breaking the Vicious Cycle. I got everything I know off of the pecanbread site. I decided to go ahead and read the book. I also bought The Low Starch Diet for IBS. I want to learn more.....

Shay - Awww, Gracie is beautiful and sounds so sweet. That is awful someone would do that....i know she is so glad and appreciative she has a wonderful home now.

Glad you're getting the book - i'm always referring to it looking up things that i can't remember....and picking out recipes i can't wait to try!

[fig girl]

I had my teeth cleaned today and had called them a couple of weeks ago to make sure what they use for cleaning is gluten free and they assured me it was pure baking soda (although it tasted a little minty). We'll see - they were very helpful and understanding. I had them cleaned shortly after going gluten-free but didn't realize i might could get glutened - i remember my stomach bothering me afterwards but since it was very early in the diet it could have been something else.

Today at work they were giving out flu shots - i don't get them because years ago i got one 2 years in a row and they made me sick with congestion and flu like symptoms both times so i don't get them. I thought i remembered reading then about a warning to not get them if allergic to eggs and i got a form today and it does say do not receive if allergic to eggs or chicken. Wonder if i have an egg allergy? I had planned on maybe getting food allergy tests done after being gluten-free for a year or so if i'm still having problems but maybe i should wait until i've been on SCD for a year. Jan. will be a year gluten-free.

Dawn and Sherry - i have random reactions also and they are better on SCD - it is easier to tell what is bothering me. I think i have a lot of damage and it's just going to take a while to be able to eat foods that are a little harder to digest. I'll have to look up histamine intolerance. Dawn, i have a lot of clearing my throat and mucous too - i think it's better after starting SCD but i still have some.

[ArtGirl]

My (sensitivity) IgG? reactinos are always delayed so it is quite confusing for me, also. I am sure the SCD will be very help for me to isolate those foods I am truly allergic/sensitive because it really acts like an elimination diet. After the intro, assuming no issues with the ingredients, one adds one food at a time, which is what one does to check for reactions.

Day 4 - detox is over! Thank goodness. Had watery D several times a day on day 2, yesterday just in the am. Today am returning to normal. I had cooked apples yesterday but they hurt my stomach, so will probably not repeat for a whhile. Since apples have caused the same reaction before, except when cooked in the pumpkin porriage, then probably I will stick to a well cooked apple ingredient rather than a whole cooked apple itself.

The crockpot coconut yogurt turned out very tasty. I've never been a fan of yogurt, but I do like the coconut milk version - much better than cow's milk (which I've never like very much). It was quite runny - which I expected because I didn't add any gelatin or drip it. Today's batch I'll add in some gelatin and see how it goes.

Today's culinary delight is going to be "creamed" butternut soup. Cooked squash, run thru the blender with added water to make a soup consistency, then added yogurt, honey and nutmeg. I've made this before with just the canned coconut milk so I know it'll be good.

After being deprived of very many foods for the last few days everything I add into my diet looks wonderful - even green beans!

The scales are going down, too. Much needed as I really need to shed 20 pounds.

Other than being tired*, I'm feeling quite good - I feel "balanced" inside.

(*Have lost sleep from caring for a post-op dog who starts whining at 3:00 am and has to go outside and I have to help him because he's wearing one of those plastic collars.)

[DMarie]

A few more questions. For those of you who do use a yogurt maker - what kind do you use? Also, it would appear from the Pecanbread site that Dannon plain yogurt (not low fat) is acceptable to use as yogurt starter. I would ultimately like to order some starter from online (such as from Kirklands as has been recommended) - but for this weekend, I would like to give this a whirl (will try using a crockpot or pot of water on the heating pad since I am not committed to a yogurt maker yet).

I am debating when to start this, if I start this. I am somewhat reluctant to start right now with Thanksgiving around the corner (which will be gluten-free). Not that I am a huge eater of Thanksgiving stuff (I am not one who gorges, I eat very moderately) - but I do like to have a piece of Pecan Pie. I don't really care about the mashed potatoes, I could even give up the stuffing, I do like sweet potatoes (fresh-mashed, sweetened with honey with some rice milk and vanilla mixed in) with the turkey. From my reading I am thinking that to start this diet, then to have any slip up on Thanksgiving would be worse than just waiting on the diet so there are no slip ups? I don't normally have an issue with avoiding what I have decided I will not eat - but not sure I want to undertake this over Thanksgiving all the same.

I have two weeks off over Christmas - so that might be an easier time to start anyway.

If it is worse to start and then have a mis-step, I am also pondering modifying my diet as I go along. Such as reducing the amount of grain, increasing the veggies, starting the homemade yogurt...moving me closer to what the SCD is. And I suppose a small part of me is hoping that making these modifications will be enough - but that remains to be seen.

[ShayFL]

I think it is fine to "ready" yourself, get through Thanksgiving and then take those 2 weeks to get used to all of the effort the diet takes. There are no real rules with regard to timing. It is up to you how you want to proceed.

This is th model I use. So far I have been happy with it. And it makes "serving sizes".

http://www.(Company Name Removed - They Spammed This Forum and are Banned)/Cuisipro-Donvier-Ele...r/dp/B0000DE4TY

[ArtGirl]

I am also pondering modifying my diet as I go along. Such as reducing the amount of grain, increasing the veggies, starting the homemade yogurt...moving me closer to what the SCD is.

That's what I did. I gave myself a month to get used to both the idea and the foods. I eliminated refined sugars and cut way back on starches. By a week I saw improvement in GI issues just with this modified diet. That gave me encouragement to not give up on the idea. A couple weeks later I was ready and eager to start.

I think it is good to give careful thought to a diet such as this. It takes commitment of time and attitude. Give some of the recipes a try, perfect your yogurt making, and when you're ready, do the intro. That's important because that's how the bad bacteria gets killed off, and then the good stuff introduced after that. And that's important to give your healing a jump start.

[AliB]

I have recently acquired a Lakeland (in the UK) yogurt maker. It comes with a liter sized pot and I also have a second one to make a fresh batch in whilst the first is still storing the previous one in the fridge.

It's this type - www.lakeland.co.uk/electric-yoghurt-maker/F/keyword/yogurt/product/3440_3441

I imagine you should be able to find a similar type over in the States - you seem to have a lot more choice than we do!

I bought mine used on Ebay - it cost me a little over half what it would have been new, so I was pleased with that, and it makes good yogurt.

[mftnchn]

DMarie, I don't think you can predict what would happen if you start the diet then go off on Thanksgiving. I bet there is a recipe out there for SCD pecan pie though.

I think ArtGirl's approach sounds like it will work for you.

Actually, I jumped right in to the intro after reading BTVC because my doctor prescribed the diet (even got the book from his office). Stool testing had shown up large amounts of sugar in the stool--which is not normal. It showed I don't have the enzymes to digest carbs (from villa damage??). So I knew I HAD to do this diet. I was just grateful I could have fruit and honey. By the time I finished the first week I had seen so much change in stools and so much die off reaction and had started to feel much better. It was much more distinct improvement than I had seen on gluten-free, so I knew I was on the right track. It provided the motivation to stick with it.

[mftnchn]

It might be fun to post our plans for Thanksgiving menu. I know I need to give this some thought. I have been staying at a pretty low stage on the diet but now with adding in the magnesium again, am doing a lot better and more ready to experiment.

Desserts: I've made pumpkin pie without the crust, and it was good though not quite sweet enough for me. I'll tweak the recipe for that next time. The apple crisp I made is my fav so far though, hands down.

That's as far as I have gotten so far, but then what does it matter if I have a great dessert I'm happy!

[AliB]

Well I reckon that Nicola Devlin's Vanilla Pumpkin Pie could easily be converted to Pecan Pie. At the end of the day it is just a filling with Pecans on top and a crumb base - make the base out of ground hazelnuts and almond as she lists, top with a honey-sweetened (not too much) filling and add the pecans. Voila.

Make your own and take it with you if you go out for lunch with family or friends. If you go to a restaurant, take a slice with you in a container, explain you are on a special diet and ask if they would mind serving it up for you - you never know, it might look so good and smell so great they may even ask you for the recipe!

Pecan Pie appears to contain not only loads of sugar but syrup also - yuk. I tell you - when you have been on the diet a week or two your desire for sweetness fades and you no longer crave the stuff. As was mentioned earlier you start to realise that actually carrots are really sweet, and squash, and string beans, and.........well, most things - except kale!

Thinking of carrots - why not add some pureed carrots to the pie filling for added sweetness and bulk. I just made the pie as straightforward pumpkin pie and even our friends who aren't on the SCD came back for seconds! I served mine with slightly honey-sweetened thick yogurt and coconut milk cream. They were keen to try that too!

You might have to try making the recipe a few times before you get it fine-tuned to your own taste (such hardship!!). Be creative and enjoy!!

Open Original Shared Link

See, if you can enjoy a roast dinner and SCD legal pecan pie, you can do the SCD over the festivity. I don't celebrate it so don't have that problem, thank goodness!

[DMarie]

Okay, I have been up and down on the whole idea throughout the afternoon. I stumbled across an SCD recipe book on Amazon that had high ratings. Plus did more reading on BTVC website (think I got the initials right). As long as I know I can cook things, have choices - I am good! I like flavorful food - otherwise, why bother eating it?! By flavorful I mean well spiced (not that it has to be a carb or sweet - I actually don't have big cravings for sweets - if it happens it is usually during my monthly cycle). I was really struggling looking at the lists of approved foods and the limited foods allowed at first. But - more searching and I see there is quite a lot out there! (just like great things can be made gluten free). And - I am excited to try my hand with the yogurt this weekend.

Then I started reading reviews of the BTVC book. The majority were good, but there were some bad as in the people said it didn't work, they followed it religiously but it caused more problems, they found it was better to do such and such variation, etc. Most people getting the book have much more severe problems than I (with the Ulcerative Colitus and such). Reading all the negative reviews caused me to pause and to not order the books, thinking that I really should just check if the library has it. Some points people made concerned me. I found myself wishing I could read more about people with food intolerances - and how has it worked for them (which is what is being shared here). So I thought I would start reading through the 40 pages here to see more from this side of the coin.

But then I thought - it is a method that has worked wonders for many. Chances are probably better it would be beneficial for me; if I try it faithfully and find I am one of the few that do not notice improvement - I have only invested a little bit of time. Still thinking and reading.

On the other hand, I did not eat any carbs this afternoon when I snacked, chose fruit instead. For lunch I did have a sandwich with gluten free bread and fruit. Some mucous, but not drowning. But, after not consuming any more grain throughout the afternoon, when it was time to leave to go home from work I realized that I hadn't had junk in my throat for several hours - not any. I was very comfortable, which is rare. There is usually some degree of drainage, although it is generally considerably improved from what it was before I dropped eggs, dairy and corn. That is encouraging to me. It further encourages me to want to eliminate the grains to see what happens longer term (which will bring me closer to SCD).

The link to the pumpkin pie looks delicious. Actually, I could be very satisfied with that! Except - can I use pumpkin and not squash? Not so sure about the squash. I have always loved Pecan Pie - though I have been thinking about it as it generally uses corn syrup and I have cut corn - so not sure about that. It is very sweet, a little goes a long way. I tend to like desserts that are not over sweet. I am usually trying to cut some sugar. Like with a fruit cobbler - I want to taste the fruit and want a very gentle sweetness about it. Not hit you over the head, overwhelming sweetness. Go figure why I still like Pecan Pie. It would be great to find an alternative that I really like. I probably could do SCD for this meal and be fine - except if I did an almond meal flour crust for the pie - that would be jumping a head just a bit.

Guess I am now just rambling with all tangents of thoughts - time to close and send.

[DMarie]

Oh my gosh!!! AliB you are right - of course there are recipes out there for SCD legal pecan pies. There are just tons of recipes waiting to be discovered!

Open Original Shared Link

The first one I saw looks wonderful!!! Actually sounds a whole lot better than the corn syrup one, I am sure I could be very satisfied with that. Don't know about the rest of the family - but I can make them theirs, and me mine. As I already cut corn, I was struggling with the fact that I always enjoy my couple of slices of this at Thanksgiving - and what was I going to choose (never mind the whole SCD thing to boot!) This one doesn't even call for a crust - how good is that!

Artgirl - I think that eliminating grains and sugars in a slow walk toward the diet is a good approach for me as well. I was already encouraged by an afternoon spent NOT clearing my throat - and I think that was because I had minimal grain from lunch on (I often have some gluten-free crackers with some fruit in the afternoon - I chose a 2nd piece of fruit instead - and as I hadn't had any gluten-free bread in a week - I didn't have a big issue with my sandwich at lunch - but did have some drainage for a short time after lunch).

Thanks to all for the yogurt maker info. I am researching. I'll see how it goes sans yogurt maker this weekend and go from there. I am so hoping it comes out right the first time. I think my husband will really like it as well.

[aprilh]

Hey everyone!

I almost got caught up reading. I some interesting news. My sons stool test results are in and it appears that he has a parasite called Blastycosis Hominis.

The interesting thing about this parasite is that it likes grains. People who have negative effects from this parasite usually have grain intolerance or allergies.

I remember about 3 years ago my son, hubby, and I got very, very sick. I thought it was a stomach virus but the symptoms were strange and something I never experienced before.

My hubby went to the dr and they ran all kinds of tests - of course they didn't find anything with all the "traditional" methods.

I don't know if this is connected at all, but it sure leaves me wondering.

My ND put together a protocol for my son. The herbs taste so bad dumped out of the capsule that I can't hide it in anything!! So, we are going to try a tincture.

I have decided to take the antiparasitic herbs he could not take. We'll see how it goes.

[AliB]

Dawn - I used ordinary pumpkin in my pumpkin pie. Nicola's recipe lists butternut squash but you can use pumpkin if you have it. We seem to be able to get butternut most of the year in the stores here in the UK but we can only get pumpkin for a few weeks at this time of the year. I have never seen canned pumpkin here but that is 'illegal' anyway.

April - that is good in some ways that they have found the Blastocystis bacteria in your son as it does pinpoint that it may be a possible cause of his problems but sad that he has it. I tell you, there are thousands of these bacteria out there, any type of which could be causing problems for us. We don't know the half of it! They only know of a limited amount of these beasties, and of those they do know of they only know a limited amount about what they do and often do not have a clue whether they are beneficial or pathogenic.

Whilst some of the strains may be beneficial to some people they can be downright pathogenic to others - it all depends on the balance of bugs in the gut and whether some are able to keep the others under control. Whilst some may be beneficial in small amounts they can become pathogenic if they get out of control. I can't quite understand why someone hasn't had the whit to analyse the flora in very healthy people to see how it compares with sick ones. Perhaps then, if they did enough sampling across the board they might start to understand what should be there and what shouldn't and which ratios of the different types of bacteria work best.

There is a huge amount of ignorance in this area but it is probably the most important field of all for medical investigation as it is quite likely that most disease originates from bacteria.

There are viral diseases but if the immune system has not been undermined by bacterial activity it should have the ability to defuse the virii without any problem. After all, there are people out there who never catch cold.

[ArtGirl]

There are viral diseases but if the immune system has not been undermined by bacterial activity it should have the ability to defuse the virii without any problem. After all, there are people out there who never catch cold

I certainly agree with you there, Ali. If one's immune system is healthy, then it can ward off illnesses, or they will be of shorter duration and more moderate. One of the motivating factors for myself in going on the SCDiet is this very thing. I get very sick from "just" a cold - almost always turns into bronchitis and lately sinus infection (which, by the way, has not completely cleared up from last December!)

I know I should have started SCD sooner to be better protected from winter viruses, but I'm hopeful that enough healing will take place over the next 6 weeks that I will not be laid low in December. (It almost always puts me in bed the week before and after Christmas.)

Dawn - I have a corn allergy, too. It is very hard on a more traditional gluten-free diet to avoid corn. But on SCD it's a non-issue. As it is with any grain or starch. I actually like the almond flour muffins and nut/date pie crusts much better than what I was able to produce gluten-free. AND the almond flour muffins are MUCH LESS WORK to prepare the dough. My husband likes them very well, so everyone is happy. My only major SCD baking problem is substituting the egg, but I'm working on that. Now that I make coconut yogurt, that ingredint doesn't have to be substitued.

[ShayFL]

I tried to cut out the eggs for a week. But I caved yesterday. I made SCD pumpkin muffins. Let's face it, the diet is poo without some of those baked goods.

[AliB]

I did a fast on Wednesday, well a sort of a fast. I didn't eat all day, just had some lemon water in the morning and drank water for the rest of the day until the evening when I had a small dinner. I didn't eat anything else after that. I had an herb tea yesterday morning and didn't eat again until lunch when I had a small lunch then a medium dinner in the evening.

I thought maybe the only way to not feed the beasties is to not feed myself!

Two things have happened, well three or four really. I have lost 4lb which is good as I had started to put some back on (I need to lose considerably more than that but its a start). It's not water as my ring doesn't feel any different so it's gone from somewhere!

It has kickstarted me back into the SCD. I had got very off-track and was not improving so doing that has reset my mind-set. I had got into the habit of nibbling during the day and especially the evening which is the worst time for me, especially if I am watching the TV. Problem was that not all I nibbled was 'legal', and was adding to the weight gain. I have to remind myself that gluten-free doesn't mean SCD free! As I am also diabetic gluten-free baked is definitely a no-no.

The third thing, and I don't know if it was just a co-incidence or not is that I had a big 'purge' last night. I was on the loo all evening! Haven't had that since before gluten-free with the IBS! Maybe it was a mini-detox or something! Whilst none of us felt all that well this week and my daughter did complain about a painful gut the day before I will have to leave that one open to speculation.

The other thing I noticed is that because I wasn't eating I was more inclined to drink. My body seems to interpret thirst as hunger so when I eat I do not think to drink enough - I rarely get through more than a liter of fluid a day, but I have been drinking more as a result which would help with detoxifying too.

I am half tempted to do that one day every week or two as it does seem to have helped me get back on the 'straight and narrow'. I will be interested to see if I get the 'purge' effect again the next time. The diabetes was not a problem because as I didn't eat anything I didn't need any insulin either. My BS levels were pretty well within normal range all day. I tell you, with all the problems that come with it, sometimes I wish we didn't have to eat (or, as I said to my daughter the other day, wouldn't life be simpler if we could be like a snake and just eat enough food in one go to last for the rest of the year!)

Anyone else ever tried fasting?

[aprilh]

There is a huge amount of ignorance in this area but it is probably the most important field of all for medical investigation as it is quite likely that most disease originates from bacteria.

There are viral diseases but if the immune system has not been undermined by bacterial activity it should have the ability to defuse the virii without any problem. After all, there are people out there who never catch cold.

I agree, Ali, this should be studied more. When researching this parasite...a lot of information was saying that they used to believe this was a normal part of gut flora. That it doesn't cause problems in some people. But in others it does. I believe that because my son was already comprimised with gut issues, that it is pathogenic to him.

We'll see how he does after his parasitic cleansing!

[DMarie]

I tried to cut out the eggs for a week. But I caved yesterday. I made SCD pumpkin muffins. Let's face it, the diet is poo without some of those baked goods.

Okay, that has me chuckling! That is part of my concern - not being able to use eggs and dairy. I see quite a few things that look tasty, lots of variety - but eggs seem to play a large part in that! I do not "know" that eggs are definitively a problem for me. I only cut them because I was miserable drowning in mucous (constant throat clearing) - they made the drop list because I had been eating them almost every day for breakfast for several years (since I dropped gluten so long ago, there went my cereals, etc). So...made sense to me that eating an item that makes the top allergen list (eggs) every day - probably is causing a problem!

That said, I have not tried eggs by themselves since I cut them about 3 weeks ago. Two or 3 times during that time span I have had an item that has egg baked in it (such as my sandwich bread yesterday) - but by and large, I have been successful in subbing out the eggs. I am worried about trying them solo - to see if there is any reaction. Maybe that is best left until I eliminate everything else. Being able to eat eggs though would be a great help on this diet. With so much else removed - I don't know that the eggs can go and the baked good survive!

I have an observation about eggs though. If egg is one of the top allergens - how does it make the okay list in this diet? I am kind of surprised at that and wondering how that ends up being okay? Perhaps the answer lies in the fact that this diet is not being set up for people with food allergies, but other issues - where eggs aren't generally a problem.