Specific Carbohydrate Diet (SCD)

[AliB]

Martha, two weeks is very little time to see any improvement yet. Elaine G recommended at least 3 months and I would say that some of us were on it for as long as 6 months before we really started to notice any kind of real improvement.

Just as it took time for your body to get into this state, it will also take time to get it back to health. We don't always realise what is going on under the surface until the symptoms start to manifest, but of course, problems can start way back.

Try not to think about the negative things - some do have difficulties with the diet because they are focusing on the 'deprivation' thing all the time. What you have to remember is that there are a huge amount of sick people out there - we are all surrounded by them. They are sick because they are caught unawares in the trap of damaging food choices just like we were at one time. They are the ones who are deprived - of good health.

The SCD is a very good, and very healthy diet. It is well-documented that disease follows hard on the heels of the 'Western' diet. If we want to be healthy, we have to eat healthy.

As you become more familiar with this way of eating - after all, we are so used to, and 'educated' into eating and preparing the easy, quick, processed, junky stuff, and not foods made with more complex preparation and/or cooking procedures - it will start to become second-nature. It is difficult at first because so many people just are not familiar with having to cook from scratch, or make unusual foods, but it does get easier.

Funny, isn't it how people around the World have prepared and eaten things like yogurt for centuries, yet we find it such an alien procedure - we who are used to just wandering into our local store and pulling the stuff off a shelf. In times of hardship, who will be the ones better able to fend for themselves?

I would say that if you are still suffering with gas and bloating then something like Candida may well be an issue. The fact that you went gluten-free may not actually have made a lot of difference because gluten-free are often typically carbohydrate-dense (and also often very high in sugar). If you have problems digesting carbs (and I wouldn't put it past Candida or other microbes to be able to switch off or diminish certain enzymes in order to protect their food source), then the undigested carbs would be a rich food source for the microbes.

If you are having too much sweet foods, albeit only naturally sweet or sweetened with honey then they will grab any carb that happens to come by. Some find they have to cut back even on those things for a few weeks so that they can start to get the beasties under control.

It may be worth you investing in some organic virgin coconut oil or caprylic acid capsules if you haven't already as that may well help too. The diet is good, and it does work for most who try it, but sometimes it helps to give it a helping hand with certain supplements. Cod Liver Oil is another good support, giving Omega 3, Vitamin A and Vitamin D which helps the body assimilate other nutrients better.

You have to remember too that you are unique, and as such have an unique set of health issues, so although a food may well be SCD legal, it doesn't mean that your body (particularly your liver) can cope with it at present. As you (and it) starts to heal and recover you should find that you can broaden your range of legal foods.

[fig girl]

Both - failure and fatigue. Everything seems to be perfectly normal in this field. And no, I haven't been tested for testosterone. Maybe that's an option, too. But now I had a short talk with my family doc who read the report and told me to look if maybe there's some heart insufficiency. They used to think there was something with my heart since I was a kid because there's kind of murmur. As I never seemed to have heart or circulation problems - always made sports without problems until now - and they couldn't for sure find anything, they dismissed that idea. But as hepatomegalie and increased CK could point to heart insufficiency and he still can hear that murmur he recommends looking into that.

Jan,

I just happened to read an article about furctose intolerance which said that modern research assumes that MOST cases aof depression which are combined with the so called irritable bowl are actually caused by fructose intolerance, because persons with fructose intolerance have too low serotonine levels. In their study they didn't find one single person with depressions who hadn't "irritable bowl", too, and turned out to be fructose intolerant. They also say exactly what you think, that maybe generally a great deal of psychological problems indeed arise from physical problems and not the other way round.

Mia,

I'm sorry you're having a time trying to figure out what's going on but i hope you get it sorted out and feel better soon. I was talking to a friend at work the other day and she was telling me about her Dr's appt (she has stomach problems too and to me it sounds like she could be celiac or may be gluten intolerant) and she said her Dr. told her that IBS is commonly referred to as the psychological disease since it can really effect us psychologically over time. My deficiency in Vit D3 seemed to make me a little depressed and just feel not myself but very quickly after increasing it i could tell a difference.

Thanks for the toothpaste recipe also - i want to try it!

[fig girl]

Caprylic Acid is of course derived from Coconut, which, because it is a powerful anti-microbial, anti-fungal and anti-parasitic, is why it works so well.

Sherry and Figgy, the problem you have with not being able to tolerate it very well could well be a 'fight-back' by the parasites, etc., in your system.

Have you tried taking the pure organic virgin coconut oil? It contains Lauric Acid as well as the Caprylic which is also a powerful anti-microbial. Apparently people who cannot tolerate Coconut can sometimes tolerate the oil.

Ali,

I've wondered myself if it's stirring things up and if i kept taking it would it eventually stop being sore. I think the last time i tried coconut i had also tried dried coconut, coconut flour and the coconut oil. I'm going to not try anything new for a little while longer but when i do try coconut again i'm going to just try the oil. Right now i have the Now brand organic virgin coconut oil but i think i had Organic Earth Fare brand coconut oil the last time i tried it. I'll check and see if the Now brand has the lauric acid. I love coconut oil - since it's getting warmer out i'll probably start back making some smoothies (Hunger buster smoothie is so yummy!) and would like to add some in my smoothie! Something to look forward to! It doesn't take much to make me happy.

[marthamom]

Ali,

Thank you so much---it's reassuring to be reminded that I'm still very early in the healing process. I do really like all of the food on the diet, and I love to cook, so I'm not really having any trouble sticking to the diet (although I've never made so many dirty dishes in my life!)....just really eager to see some positive results.

I will look into the supplements you mention---there's so much to learn!!

Thanks again,

Martha

[fig girl]

Hi Fig girl,

If you take the caprylic acid against candida, I think the safest is to go for a long period, maybe 3 months. I've taken it for around that period of time by now, and am cutting down my dosage but keep taking a little to be sure the candida doesn't have a chance to recur.

And yes, lemon works well for the liver - particularly if drunk in warm water on an empty stomach first thing in the morning. I can tolerate it now, but before going on the SCD I'd never have been able to deal with the acid, as it is pretty tough on a sensitive stomach.

Jan

Hi Jan and thanks for the Capryl info - i'll try it for 3 mths as i'm pretty sure i have a candida problem. The last time i did the spit test i had some cloudy stuff at the bottom of the glass. Unfortunately i still can't do lemon Maybe i was over doing it a bit before so when i try it again i'll do very little. I think my liver has trouble expelling things too since i'm so sensitive to toxins also - some beef and pork doesn't do well with me. The less additives and if they're organic is better.

[fig girl]

Yes, just a comment though. Be cautious about it. I guess it can be fairly powerful although it sounds innocuous. I'm sticking pretty close to the 20 minutes, twice a week, until I know for sure how it will impact me.

Thanks for the reminder about lemon juice. I need to get some lemons and add that in.

Thanks for the warning Sherry...i appreciate it. Let me know how you get along with it. I hope it'll help you out. I may try it later on if it seems to help you and if i feel i still may need it. I hope eating my safe foods for a bit longer will help me improve even more.

[fig girl]

Hi Martha and Janie,

Everyone has given you great advice so i just wanted to say that i know how you feel and to hang in there. I made the mistake for a while trying to add too many new legal foods and had to take a step back and just figure out what i was tolerating and add a new food very slowly and very far apart to know what was giving me what symptoms. I'll be back doing that soon but for now i'm sticking with my safe foods a little longer so my gut can hopefully heal a little more.

I was eating natural peanut butter too in the beginning and ate a little raw which i couldn't tolerate at all and nuts either. The only raw i'm eating right now is romaine lettuce and occasionally a raw carrot and i'll juice some lettuce, kale and carrot but have to dilute it with a good bit of water. I'd never had so many dirty dishes either when i first started but it gets better! I've tried to be more green around the house and am but here lately i do eat on paper plates pretty often....just saves me from having to wash another dish!

[marthamom]

Hi Martha and Janie,

Everyone has given you great advice so i just wanted to say that i know how you feel and to hang in there. I made the mistake for a while trying to add too many new legal foods and had to take a step back and just figure out what i was tolerating and add a new food very slowly and very far apart to know what was giving me what symptoms. I'll be back doing that soon but for now i'm sticking with my safe foods a little longer so my gut can hopefully heal a little more.

I was eating natural peanut butter too in the beginning and ate a little raw which i couldn't tolerate at all and nuts either. The only raw i'm eating right now is romaine lettuce and occasionally a raw carrot and i'll juice some lettuce, kale and carrot but have to dilute it with a good bit of water. I'd never had so many dirty dishes either when i first started but it gets better! I've tried to be more green around the house and am but here lately i do eat on paper plates pretty often....just saves me from having to wash another dish!

Thanks so much for the support---I guess I'm going to back off on the peanut butter for a while (which is hard...I LOVE it), and probably cut out the gelatin too for now. Good luck with your healing too!

[Ms Jan]

Hi Mia,

Thanks for the info on the article on the psychological dependency on the physical - and on the fructose malabsorption. Interesting!

Hope you're getting better,

Jan

[mftnchn]

Thanks so much---how long were you gluten free before switching to SCD? Have your antibody levels come down even though you still have some symptoms? Have you had an endoscopy since going on SCD?

How would I go about getting the Metametrix test? Is it something I would ask my gastro to do?

Thanks again!

I was 15 months gluten-free before switching to SCD (via my doctor's recommendation). I haven't rechecked antibody levels but I did recheck my fat malabsorption. I haven't had an endoscopy since going on SCD.

You can get info on the test from the www.metametrix.com website. It does require your doctor's order. You might just call the lab, perhaps you can order a kit sent to you, and take it to your doctor and get them to sign it. If your doc wants to do a regular ova and parasite test, just respectfully say no, you want a test like this one that checks for the parasite DNA. (At least, this is what I would do!)

It really depends on your doctor. I had a routine colonoscopy shortly after starting SCD. I told the FNP about seeing parasites, she gasped and was totally shocked, saying "where did you get THAT?" Finally she said, "oh you had traveled overseas." Her attitude was especially nasty. I was angry and just shut up, LOL! I guess she thinks that parasites are literate and read the "no parasites allowed" signs at the USA borders, LOL. Anyway, the ignorance and attitude was appalling.

I'm fortunate to have a really sharp doctor--he's the one who told me he had found this test that was much more accurate and he was picking up infections in a lot of his patients who had never traveled.

[Bee-Jr]

Good morning,

It is certainly comforting to come to this thread and find all this good information and encouraging advice. I appreciate it so much.

I think I am still being too ambitious about adding foods, and am having a hard time making myself slow down. I do now have the yogurt right, and seem to be doing well with it, but I ate kidney beans yesterday, and OMG. I have to leave the beans alone for a while. Really, Jane. Don't eat any beans for a while. Jeez, I frustrate myself.

This will probably be TMI, but you know, after a few days without all the gas and the unpleasantness that goes along with it, it's just about disgusting to have even a little bit of it. Turns my stomach. At first I thought I was going to be ok, but then about 6 p.m. yesterday, all of a sudden...I wasn't ok.

Also would like to know what you all think if I were to say that I believe candida may be my WHOLE problem. What if I'm not exactly gluten intolerant? What if I'm not allergic to peanuts? I thought I was allergic to nightshades, but within the confines of the SCD, I have been absolutely fine with tomato juice. What if my problems with potatoes have been just because of the starch? Peanuts because of mold? Monday afternoon, when my face started to itch so, it wasn't because I had eaten anything I have isolated as being the cause of an intolerance or allergy. It was just popcorn and chocolate, which has NOT made me itch ever before. So I'll bet that it was because I ate too many carbs in too short an expanse of time.

Every one of the things I've had problems with has been a sugar, a starch, or a known mold/fungus carrier.

The only thing it doesn't explain is the malabsorption issue. I don't have symptoms nearly so bad now, but before I started my diet last year, my skin looked like it belonged on a 65-year-old person. I'm 53. But I guess if candida can cause chronic diarrhea, it would indirectly cause malabsorption, wouldn't it?

Just thinking out loud, but I'll certainly value your opinions.

Janie

Edited to add: Also wanted to ask about something I read yesterday...and yeah, this is gross, too. But occasionally when I cough or have to clear my throat, I'll get these little white chunks of "stuff" out of there. The blurb I read yesterday said that this is candida-related, too. Anyone have any experience with this, or more information? I'm so sorry to be disgusting, but I trust you all a lot more than I trust some anonymous article I read on the Internet. Tks.

[AliB]

I did the peanut butter thing at the beginning too - ooh, ooh, something yummy I can eat! I eventually had to back off all things 'nut' for a while as my body really couldn't cope with them, but I seem to be ok now.

I think i was fooling myself that because I was eating it with celery and apples it was ok but I think we have to be careful not to 'dive in' too quickly to everything that is legal. Better to just start with intro for a few days then gradually start to introduce other foods one or two at a time and see how we go.

[mftnchn]

I think it is possible for some people that candida is the main problem. However, I think there are so many factors contributing to health in the gut that usually it is more than one simple cause.

I'm experiencing BM changes on my current treatment of protozoan infection; too early to tell if it is going to be another jump forward in healing or just a side effect of the medication. Have had three pretty miserable days with headache and abdominal symptoms, but better this morning So I think this treatment is getting at something. What I am learning is that for me, diet and herbals have clearly not been enough to get at the bad infections. (They have helped tremendously, just that some of the infections have been very persistent.)

[mftnchn]

I was talking to a friend at work the other day and she was telling me about her Dr's appt (she has stomach problems too and to me it sounds like she could be celiac or may be gluten intolerant) and she said her Dr. told her that IBS is commonly referred to as the psychological disease since it can really effect us psychologically over time.

A number of years ago I was doing research for my master's thesis on the connection between chronic illness and psychological factors. There was actually a lot of studies about this. The studies on IBS in this area were the most numerous. For example, patients with IBS have a much higher incidence of child sexual abuse in their history, than in the normal population. (high psychological stress)

My conclusion was that it was best to think of them as interrelated but not view the psychological as directly causing the physical or the physical directly causing the psychological. More as two parts of the same whole with uniqueness in each case. Anyway, that's my take on it.

[AliB]

Sherry, is it worth you trying virgin Coconut oil? It seems to be anti-protozoan amongst all the other 'anti's'. I know you said you can't cope with it but that may actually be a reaction to it by the pathogens.

I am viewing this as another avenue through which to tackle the beggars, and so far I am hopeful. The fact that I have more energy suggests that they are not depleting it as much as they were, so I will keep going with it for the time being and see how it goes.

[psawyer]

The subject of this thread is the Specific Carbohydrate Diet. The last three posts prior to this one have nothing to do with that subject, but seem to be about intestinal parasites. Please stick to the topic. Click here to review the board rules.

[mftnchn]

SCD diet resulted in a rapid release of visible parasites for me. So I see it as clearly related and very much on topic. It is also one of the premises of the diet, according to Elaine. Undigested carbohydrates feed parasites and mess up the gut ecology.

[mftnchn]

Ali, I seem to have a clearly allergic response to coconut products rather than what I associate with die-off. Also I can't get the virgin coconut oil out here. Perhaps after a longer period of SCD and further healing, this allergy response will subside.

[pele]

Good morning,

I need an attitude adjustment. Can anyone help me out?

. I have nothing with me for lunch, but decided to go to the grocery store to get something legal. We have some limited cooking facilities here (microwaves and electric griddles) so all is not lost, if I can just make myself buy the right things.

Also discovered over the past couple of days that I haven't been making my yogurt correctly.

But please, talk to me, folks. I have absolutely got to stop eating junk.

Thanks,

Janie

Hi Janie

From your last several posts, I get the feeling you are struggling to stay on the SCD, or any healthy diet.

I would think that one hard and fast rule for anyone who is celiac or gluten-intolerant is plan ahead. Do not leave home without safe food. It could be too tempting to eat the wrong things if your blood sugar is low or you are really hungry. Take fresh fruit, raw veggie sticks, a sandwich bag of cooked meat, hard boiled eggs, nuts, raisins, anything on the legal list. Pack it in a six-pack cooler with ice.

Make sure your freezer is well-stocked and cook enough to have leftovers. Make meatloaf or meatballs, roast a whole chicken or turkey or chuck roast, and freeze leftovers. Keep fresh and frozen vegetables on hand. Dry curd cottage cheese can be frozen. If you are baking with nut flour and eggs, freeze some of that, too. Keep a supply of bananas, apples and oranges.

Elaine says that you can eat the legal foods in any quantity. I sugget picking a few foods and eating as much as you want so you don't feel deprived. Chicken soup? Almonds? Yogurt and honey? Carrots and cucumbers? Apples? Whatever works for you.

Remember that without grain and sugar, you will get hungry if you don't eat more of the things that are legal.

As far as yogurt, the diet can be a success without it. Elaine enthusiatically recommmended kimchi, a raw fermented probiotic rich food. Or make raw sauerkraut and try making kefir. Or buy kombucha.

It can take a few weeks to get out of the processed food mindset, but once you do, things will look a lot brighter.

The first benefits you see may not be the ones you expect.

[Matchew]

Hi, I've been following this diet for just over two weeks now. Before that I had been gluten-free for about 6-7 years and wheat free before that for a few years.

I just need reassurance. Before I had completely eliminated diarrhea problems unless I accidentally ate gluten. However since starting the diet I have had 2 occasions that start off with painful bloating, then quickly needing to void first yeasty white stuff then solid stools and finally diarrhea. This time the diarrhea had quite a bit of white almost jellyfish-like substance floating in it. I'm hoping it's just parasite/yeast "die off", but I am worried I have made myself intolerant of certain foods that I could tolerate before.

These episodes seem to follow having butter in the morning, and I have had aches after having coconut oil in the morning too. I've just introduced yoghurt, but I'm hoping it was the butter as yoghurt seems to be an important part of the diet. I need to start keeping a food diary. Having read through a bit of this thread it seems lots of people have had the same thing happen, so hopefully it is normal and will clear up, but I am going to take it slooooow as I can from now on.

As far as staying strict I don't seem to have any problems yet, though it is quite expensive as the only thing that keeps me full is meat at the moment. My mum doesn't think a meal is a meal some form of potato, but we have a decent menu going on now. Haven't been very successful with gravy yet, that is one thing I need to get sorted!

[jmd3]

Incorporating the scd a bit into my meals, love the homemade yogurt. Can tolerate it, and even eat a bit of REAL cheese if I eat a bit of yogurt too.

What I am wondering about it when I eat the almond flour - I felt like I had been beat up -- I was so stiff and sore all around my body, almost like I had done thousands of sit-ups, that kind of achy feeling. Has anyone had any experience with this? or have any thoughts?

[pele]

", but I am worried I have made myself intolerant of certain foods that I could tolerate before.

Hi There

I don't think you have made yourself intolerant of other foods in two weeks. Probably you have been feeding a big colony of undesirable bacteria and pehaps yeast, and since you have eliminated the foods you can't digest, that the bacteria have been living on, there is a die-off.

I'm sorry your mum thinks the diet is expensive. It is actually quite economical. No more $4 bagels or $9 loaves of bread. No more expensive cookies or candies. Ask her to buy ground meat (buffalo, beef, lamb, turkey) which is cheaper than steak and use it for breakfast, lunch and dinner. Chicken's not too bad cost-wise. Buy vegetables in season and grow your own if possible. Same with fruit. Do you have a store that sells nuts, honey and/or peanut butter in bulk?

If you have not used coconut oil prior to starting the SCD, you may want to back off on it for a bit if you think it is bothering you.

[Gobbie]

Carbohydrate diet!

Recently I discovered Carbohydrate Intolerance.

I have not been aware of it until then... do I have this?

Similar to you, I am intolerant to gluten and lactose quite severely.

Plus those two are not the only ones.

Red meat, fried food especially deep fried, heavy seasoned food, salty food, grains especially rice and potatoes and egg yolks cause bad indigestion so I avoid them completely. Plus the Chinese herb doctor also advised me to take chicken out of my diet which I have for almost half a year now and yes, it has improved my digestive system.

I never liked the food lists mentioned above so I am feeling pretty great although dining out is rather difficult and 99% if the time I am either dissatisfied with meal or fall ill from them.

Plus sparkling drinks are suppose to assist in digestion but they always seem to add on a lump on my stomach and causes more inconvenience down below.

Perhaps I need to be on a specific Carbohydrate free diet?

Oh, and carrots ALWAYS cause abnormal bloating.. They have the possiblity for bloating but with me, it is rather severe. Perhaps I am carbohydrate intolerant.... lol.

[pele]

Incorporating the scd a bit into my meals, love the homemade yogurt. Can tolerate it, and even eat a bit of REAL cheese if I eat a bit of yogurt too.

What I am wondering about it when I eat the almond flour - I felt like I had been beat up -- I was so stiff and sore all around my body, almost like I had done thousands of sit-ups, that kind of achy feeling. Has anyone had any experience with this? or have any thoughts?

My only thought is if you have not been eating a lot of almonds, then maybe you just ate too much at a time. You don't need to eat any nut flours on the SCD, they are simply an option.

Remember, the SCD is not so much about what you eat as what you do NOT eat.

[pele]

Carbohydrate diet!

Wow, gobbie, what do you eat?

Here is a link to the breaking the vicious cycle website that will give you info on the SCD, including the leagl foods list:

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