Corn

[designerstubble]

I recently have become intolerant to corn after 3-4 months gluten free...

I seem to tolerate small amounts without any gi symptoms, but larger amounts (like a bowl of corn flakes) gets it all going horribly wrong for a couple of days or more.

Should I continue to eat small amounts or just completely avoid.

Do I need to avoid things with corn flour/starch?

How long would you say before I try re introduction, is it worth trying after 6months free or would it need years?

If I consume any corn does it actually damage my intestines the same way as gluten? (The symptoms defo feel the same!)

Sorry for all the questions. Any info appreciated... I'm hoping one day I can eat it again properly, I love corn!

[IrishHeart]

No, on the damage to your intestines. Not the same gluten protein that celiacs need to avoid.

Take it out for a while then add it back in. Some people tolerate various forms of corn (starch, flour) but not the whole corn kernels--and vice versa..

And frankly, many people have trouble digesting it fully--if you get my drift . (like me, but I love it and I eat it fresh whenever it's available) whereas corn starch, citric acid, etc. does not bother me at all.

But, like ANY food that you feel is bothersome, just take it out (all forms) for a month or two (some people say 3-6 months) and then, try it alone-- not with any other foods ---and see what happens.

Do not despair; you're still healing and in time, you may very well get all the foods back. Just remember that occasional bowels issues are not always because of gluten CC or that you're damaging your villi somehow. I wondered the same things when I first started out, too.

Sometimes, it is just because your GI tract is still healing. Give it time. Hang in there!

[kareng]

Those were gluten-free corn flakes? Regular corn flakes wrn't gluten-free.

[designerstubble]

Thanks Irish Heart! So when you say not digesting it fully you mean seeing it a bit later on again?!! This is what happens to me also!!

Interesting... Didn't know citric acid is corn based?

Soooo much to learn. You guys must have Phd's in Celiac Disease!

Ok, I'm also wondering if it was the corn that caused my loose BM? I used to eat baby crisps made from 60% corn... Haven't had them for a while and my 'movements' (!!) are better.

Aaaaanyway. I hope you're right about getting it back. Pleeeease! Thanks for your help.

I'm wonder why then we react. Is it purely because the body is 'wanting' to react to something and sees a similar gluten etc... ie body has gone a bit haywire? Why would it not react possibly in 6months? Is it because it has 'forgotten'? Sorry. I'm very naive with the terminology!

Kareng, thanks, they are gluten free corn flakes defo!

[bartfull]

Corn never gave me digestive symptoms. As a matter of fact, gluten didn't give me bad digestive symptoms either, although it does now. What they both gave me was psoriasis. I still get psoriasis from corn meal, but corn starch doesn't bother me anymore. That has opened up a whole realm of foods that I can now eat. I can eat Udi's bread, but not Canyon Bakehouse because Canyon Bakehouse has corn meal. (Rats!! I LOVE that stuff!) But the best part is that I no longer have to have meds made at the compounding pharmacy. Almost ALL pills have cornstarch filler. It's nice to be able to buy Tylenol at the store for $6, when it used to cost $36 for a smaller bottle!

[cavernio]

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A Vojdani, I Tarash - Food and Nutrition, 2013

a few articles that talk about immune or body reactions to corn in celiacs. I've read at least 1 more but I can't find it again.

If being gluten free isn't enough for you, then you should really look at other foods, including corn. In any case, being on this board you probably know that many people who have serious reactions to gluten don't have villi damage. The same can go with other foods as well.

[IrishHeart]

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A Vojdani, I Tarash - Food and Nutrition, 2013

a few articles that talk about immune or body reactions to corn in celiacs. I've read at least 1 more but I can't find it again.

If being gluten free isn't enough for you, then you should really look at other foods, including corn. In any case, being on this board you probably know that many people who have serious reactions to gluten don't have villi damage. The same can go with other foods as well.

The discussion about this maize study was raised some time ago, if you would like to read this:

It is not a gluten cross reaction, according to Skylark, who is a scientist. (I miss her! She always had access to some interesting materials

and could interpret some of the more complex articles for the members) .

[IrishHeart]

I'm wonder why then we react. Is it purely because the body is 'wanting' to react to something and sees a similar gluten etc... ie body has gone a bit haywire? Why would it not react possibly in 6months? Is it because it has 'forgotten'? Sorry. I'm very naive with the terminology!

You use the word "react". Do you mean you get a stomach ache? Bad bowels movements? These are not unusual with corn, or any food for that matter when you are still healing your gut.

Time is the reason you may be able to tolerate more foods. As you have removed all gluten, your gut starts to heal, the villi regrow and the inflammation in your body starts to calm down. Then, foods that are greasy, tough to digest, or acidic will be more easily tolerated. (Right now, your digestive tract is still damaged and these foods may be problematic).

That's the general idea anyway.

[designerstubble]

Thanks for all the replies. I must admit I am slightly confused as to whether its even safe for some celiacs to eat corn? (Irishheart, the report you posted seemed to imply that some celiacs might have damaged guts from corn? And that there were no follow ups to see if they healed after removing it??)

I appreciate that this probably isn't the case for most but must admit my reactions to corn feel the same as to gluten. As in frequent diarrhea, gut pain, and even the aches and pains. I have milder symptoms (loose bowel and rumbling guts) when I have a small amount of corn.

I hope I'm a lucky one that is able to re introduce. I have no idea where to start with getting rid of every corn trace in my food. It's everywhere isn't it. Ugh!

Thanks again to all

[IrishHeart]

Thanks for all the replies. I must admit I am slightly confused as to whether its even safe for some celiacs to eat corn? (Irishheart, the report you posted seemed to imply that some celiacs might have damaged guts from corn? And that there were no follow ups to see if they healed after removing it??)

I appreciate that this probably isn't the case for most but must admit my reactions to corn feel the same as to gluten. As in frequent diarrhea, gut pain, and even the aches and pains. I have milder symptoms (loose bowel and rumbling guts) when I have a small amount of corn.

I hope I'm a lucky one that is able to re introduce. I have no idea where to start with getting rid of every corn trace in my food. It's everywhere isn't it. Ugh!

Thanks again to all

No, hon, that was not my link that was posted (I believe cavernio posted to those studies).I just added the discussion that occured as a result (from an older thread).

The thread I posted the link to states the opposite--it is not a "gluten cross-reaction".

I wanted you to be encouraged by what the science had to say, not to make you overly concerned. I guessed that was a bad idea. sorry

It's only ONE study anyway.

I do NOT believe corn damages celiac guts like wheat gluten does.

I DO believe you are having digestive issues, yes--for the reasons I have previously stated.

In any case, do not eat it if it bothers you. Could be difficult for you to digest right now.

Hang in there!

[beachbirdie]

No, hon, that was not my link that was posted (I believe cavernio posted to those studies).I just added the discussion that occured as a result (from an older thread).

The thread I posted the link to states the opposite--it is not a "gluten cross-reaction".

I wanted you to be encouraged by what the science had to say, not to make you overly concerned. I guessed that was a bad idea. sorry

It's only ONE study anyway.

I do NOT believe corn damages celiac guts like wheat gluten does.

I DO believe you are having digestive issues, yes--for the reasons I have previously stated.

In any case, do not eat it if it bothers you. Could be difficult for you to digest right now.

Hang in there!

I don't have the citations yet, but my DIL recently shared with me that she saw some studies pointing not to gut damage from non-gluten grains, but pointing to some evidence that grains like rice, corn, and others have enough similarity to gluten that they fool receptors and cause an increase in the body's autoimmune responses. She's out of town right now, I'll get the citations from her at some point. She is a graduate in a science field and I trust her evaluation of the validity of studies.

Just throwing that out for thought at this point!

[IrishHeart]

I don't have the citations yet, but my DIL recently shared with me that she saw some studies pointing not to gut damage from non-gluten grains, but pointing to some evidence that grains like rice, corn, and others have enough similarity to gluten that they fool receptors and cause an increase in the body's autoimmune responses. She's out of town right now, I'll get the citations from her at some point. She is a graduate in a science field and I trust her evaluation of the validity of studies.

Just throwing that out for thought at this point!

Yes please---I'd love to see them! Skylark and I spent a long time looking for these types of articles on Pub Med--and she had access to other sources as well--and if anyone ever finds anything, they should most definitely post them!!

[kareng]

I think that if corn or soda pop or juniper bushes bother you - don't eat it, bathe in it or roll in it! It doesn't mean it has gluten or "gluten-like" substances.

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[shadowicewolf]

I think that if corn or soda pop or juniper bushes bother you - don't eat it, bathe in it or roll in it! It doesn't mean it has gluten or "gluten-like" substances.

Open Original Shared Link

Exactly. I think part of the reason we say "gluten-like" is because we really don't have much to compare it to.

[ncdave]

This thread may be of some intrest to you, if your looking for corn free foods. We have not posted in it for some time, I think we ran out of corn free foods. https://www.celiac.com/forums/topic/97786-thread-for-gluten-free-dairy-soy-corn-and-nightshade-free-recipes/

[Takala]

I thought I might have a corn problem at one time, but it turns out that I just have a "pretty sensitive to any sort of cross contamination in the corn product problem." The way I tested it was to remove corn products, then reintroduced it by taking a fresh ear of corn, shucking it, and then slicing off the kernels and whirring them in a magicbullet with a little bit of water to make corn slush. Then cooked with this. No reaction. No reaction to fresh corn, either.

I had to ditch most commercial corn products (all but one kind of gluten-free blue corn flour) because they can be cross contaminated with gluten free oat flours. I seem to be in that small subgroup of gluten-free "oat reactors" which means I have to be super careful now with any sort of store - bought grain item or flour. I thought I had finally found a brand of gluten free, GMO free corn chip I could tolerate, then after several bags I noticed the label had changed and they are using any of 3 different types of oils to cook them in, and my guess is that their going to a cheaper oil blend is putting more cross contamination into the chain, because I noticed I my skin was suddenly getting more sensitive again, and I was getting a bit of a rash on my midsection and under one arm, where underclothing touched. Now, was this a contact reaction to something, or a secondary infection from eating the wrong thing, again ? I had not changed soaps or toiletries or anything, but it looked like what happens if I eat the wrong thing, then touch hay. Ditched the chips and another kind of nut that I had started to eat concurrently, and the rash went away, after I also treated the rash carefully with some herbal anti fungals (listerine kills anything in my house ). I could tell it was not a gluten reaction, because the rest of me wasn't having any reactions, no swelling, no brain fog, no neuro symptoms, no joint flareups, and my gluten reaction is very distinct. Now when it does not matter, I will try to re introduce the corn chip and the nuts again separately, and see what happens. In fact, I've already used a little bit of my "safe" corn flour and had no reaction, so it is probably the oils in the chips or the nuts.

Trying to sort this stuff out continues to be exasperating at times. I am sure the chip maker has tested the chips and they are, from a technical standpoint, completely gluten free, and safe for most celiacs and gluten intolerants, but, from a oat cross contamination standpoint, from any one of the three possible cooking oils, they are not. Were those fields the oil seed producing plants where grown in, done in a way that they were not crop rotated with either wheat, barley, or oats? Unlikely. Yes, but the oils are technically gluten free because of processing, I realize. This is not the first time this has happened. And who knows ? I could be fine with the next bag of chips if I try them.

This is why I don't even try eating most commercial cereal products anymore, on a daily basis, it just doesn't work, because these manufacturers are buying base ingredients from all different sources, and changing things slightly all the time.

[designerstubble]

Thanks for everyone that posted here, I've been meaning to respond but have been off the forum for a few days with family 'stuff' going on.

Anyway. Irish Heart, I very much hope you are right... That I will be able to get corn back. I've had yet another mystery reaction last night... Am a bit bewildered by it all.

Takala... Thank you so much for your information, it has really helped. I don't know where to start with corn. I have avoided most corn products, actually avoided most/all processed foods. Yesterday I decided to bake my son a gluten free cake. I bought a flour mix of tapioca, maize, buckwheat and potato. I got on fine, finished the cake with buttercream. Used a few colours. That's it. I then blew a balloon up and realised it had some kind of powder in it. I quickly washed my mouth out. Slowly my tummy began rumbling and making noises. This continued until it was full blown and I needed to 'go' a couple times, I felt a bit jittery too, a few tummy cramps. I am so cross. I was up with this until 3am. I am ok this morning... I think? Except for tired. But probably because I have been up half the night.

I feel so despondent. I don't even know what I reacted to. I didn't try the cake or sample any of it. I knew that a bowl of cornflakes upset me but surely not just making a cake with corn flour in it? Thinking that this will possibly just keep getting worse is utterly depressing. I get such a terrible sinking feeling when I think about it. I don't know what to eat anymore... Being veggie, df, gluten-free, citrus free, lentil/chickpea free, sugar free, caffeine free, nut free, grain free, soy free, egg free. My intolerances and allergies just keep on coming. I can't survive on just fruit and veg. This last event has just sunken me to newer depths

Anyone know... The scd diet... Is it suitable for vegetarians? Apparently from what I read it may help?? Should I reconsider eating meat again?? I've been veggie for 25 years, and the thought of it makes me wanna vom.

Can't believe this corn thing.

If it were a case of just being gluten free, life would be so easy? If only.

Help. I'm miserable on my sons 6th birthday and I really don't want to be!

[ncdave]

I have thought many times exactly what you said, if I could just eat gluten free it would be so easy. Corn hides in so many places, the powder on the balloon was more than likely corn starch. The flour for the cake more than likely got into the air an ended up on your lips. Then from the lips to the tummy. In the USA all meat is washed with citric acid, citric acid is made from corn. Iodide in salt is made from corn along with plastic bottles an bowls. Check your hair spray. Allmost all meds have corn in them. Corn is ever where. I suggest you take a look at this site it will help you out with avoiding corn Open Original Shared Link

[designerstubble]

I have thought many times exactly what you said, if I could just eat gluten free it would be so easy. Corn hides in so many places, the powder on the balloon was more than likely corn starch. The flour for the cake more than likely got into the air an ended up on your lips. Then from the lips to the tummy. In the USA all meat is washed with citric acid, citric acid is made from corn. Iodide in salt is made from corn along with plastic bottles an bowls. Check your hair spray. Allmost all meds have corn in them. Corn is ever where. I suggest you take a look at this site it will help you out with avoiding corn Open Original Shared Link

[designerstubble]

I have thought many times exactly what you said, if I could just eat gluten free it would be so easy. Corn hides in so many places, the powder on the balloon was more than likely corn starch. The flour for the cake more than likely got into the air an ended up on your lips. Then from the lips to the tummy. In the USA all meat is washed with citric acid, citric acid is made from corn. Iodide in salt is made from corn along with plastic bottles an bowls. Check your hair spray. Allmost all meds have corn in them. Corn is ever where. I suggest you take a look at this site it will help you out with avoiding corn Open Original Shared Link

Ncdave, thanks. The more I look into it the more its just a night mare? Why is the corn affecting me like gluten I'm so cross with my body. Is there corn starch in balloons then?? Maybe it was that then?? I just can't believe that I would be so severely affected? I literally had the thing in my mouth for 5 seconds before realising and quickly washing my mouth out.

Ugh. Sorry to rant and complain. I'm sick of it all at the moment, wish I could give food up.

[ncdave]

They use corn starch when making balloons to stop them from sticking to the molds, same thing with marsh mellows. Who knows what made you sick, but when you include corn you have to become very careful same as you did when going gluten-free. I think they use corn even more than gluten, Must be cheaper. I have no idea why we started reacting to all this stuff but like you I wish it would all go away!!!!!!! I was gluten-free for 9 months before finding corn was making me just as sick as gluten was, if not worse. As bad as you want you can not give up food, soon as you get the corn figured out you will start to feel so well it makes life worth living again. Corn made all the difference in the world for me to start feeling better, when you throw the balloons away make sure to wash your hands. Feel free to vent I know exactly how you feel, that's what were all here for. Hope you feel better real soon, an let us know how it goes. dave

[bartfull]

Here is another website that might help: Open Original Shared Link

I know exactly how discouraged and disgusted you feel! Getting cornstarch back has saved my sanity. I too often said, "If it were just gluten this would be easy!" Once you get used to knowing ALL of the things that might contain corn, even though your diet and even activities (like blowing up balloons) will be restricted, at least you will start feeling better.

Avoiding corn is harder than anything I have ever had to do. I hope and pray that you too will at least get cornstarch back.

[designerstubble]

They use corn starch when making balloons to stop them from sticking to the molds, same thing with marsh mellows. Who knows what made you sick, but when you include corn you have to become very careful same as you did when going gluten-free. I think they use corn even more than gluten, Must be cheaper. I have no idea why we started reacting to all this stuff but like you I wish it would all go away!!!!!!! I was gluten-free for 9 months before finding corn was making me just as sick as gluten was, if not worse. As bad as you want you can not give up food, soon as you get the corn figured out you will start to feel so well it makes life worth living again. Corn made all the difference in the world for me to start feeling better, when you throw the balloons away make sure to wash your hands. Feel free to vent I know exactly how you feel, that's what were all here for. Hope you feel better real soon, an let us know how it goes. dave

Thanks Dave... It's so depressing... How long have you been corn free? Have you ever tried re introducing? And if it didn't work did you continue to have the same response? Are you ok with rice? Have you removed it from your household entirely?

!!! Sorry!!! So many questions! Ugh! I really don't eant to remove corn from the household... My son is on a restricted diet enough already what with gluten removal and various allergies that he has... (Removal of corn would be catastrophic for him)...

Obviously I don't want to damage my guts either!

Again many thanks for your help...

Kimmy

[designerstubble]

Here is another website that might help: Open Original Shared Link

I know exactly how discouraged and disgusted you feel! Getting cornstarch back has saved my sanity. I too often said, "If it were just gluten this would be easy!" Once you get used to knowing ALL of the things that might contain corn, even though your diet and even activities (like blowing up balloons) will be restricted, at least you will start feeling better.

Avoiding corn is harder than anything I have ever had to do. I hope and pray that you too will at least get cornstarch back.

Bartfull! I am SO disgusted with my state of affairs... As much as I wouldn't wish this on anyone... It is nice to know (reassuring) that other people understand. My friends and family think I'm a freak. Should I cut corn out completely (ie should I try something once to see if it bothers me)... I was going to try some fresh corn yesterday in case I was ok with it but didn't have the 'guts' (hehe).

What symptoms did you get with corn? When did you try reintroducing corn starch? How did you do that and how long with out were you? Have you been celiac long? I've been trying to eat mainly whole foods so I'm really annoyed that my bowels have decided to do this 5 months on... Especially after the allergies I have recently acquired.

Again, sorry for sooooo many questions, I'm so frustrated. Corn. Of all things. I had rice tonight. And my tummy rumbled and grumbled. I cannot express the paranoia I felt. Still waiting to see if rice is on its way out too?

Thank you for your help...

[bartfull]

I suspect I have been celiac for many years but was in denial about it. (I am self-diagnosed, but my Mom was biopsy-diagnosed so the likelyhood that my problems were from celiac made sense. When I fianlly went gluten-free about 20 months ago and saw my symptoms clear up, I knew.) It was only a few weeks in that I made some gluten-free cornbread, and after having felt better than I ever had in my life, I got sick again. Even those corn based plastic bottles got me after that. It was a year after being away from corn that I found out I could now tolerate cornstarch.

What happened was this: I had an abcessed tooth. I needed an antibiotic but the compounding pharmacy where I have had to have all my medications made (because almost every pill on earth contains corn) was out of the ingredients. They wouldn't have them for a few days but I needed the antibiotic right away. My doctor said it would be better to get sick than to die, so he wrote me a 'scrip for the regular ones. Even the pharmacist said, "You can't have these, they're full of cornstarch!" But then he noticed my swollen face and said, "Oh yeah, I guess you'd better take them."

I never got sick. After that I went out and bought some Udi's bread. No problem. Then I tried Canyon Bakehouse bread, but that didn't work so well because it has corn MEAL as well as corn starch. So I know I can have the starch, but that is the only corn product I can tolerate - so far. I'm going to wait another six months or so and try again.

My most noticible symptom from corn is psoriasis, but I have digestive symptoms too. Not as bad as what gluten gives me, but noticible. I get foggy-headed and insomnia too. Gluten gives me all of those things PLUS nausea. (It never did until I had been gluten-free for a while.)

Everyone is different, but if I were you I would stay away from corn altogether for a while. When I first started my system was so messed up I could barely eat anything. Even sweet potatoes and broccoli from the grocery store made me sick. I had to go completely organic for a few months until things settled down. Stick to bland foods that you know are safe and let your system settle down too. Then in a few months you can try adding things back.